Despite drawing a lot of initial attention I (28/M) can’t seem to ever move things forward.
Every time I am out - bars, clubs or even just streets - I seem to get plenty of stares. Some of them will be very explicit. I sometimes even get approached directly by girls, despite this not being very common in the area where I live (capital city in Eastern Europe).
Almost invariably, however, I see the interest vane either as we keep chatting or the day after. I have tried multiple approaches (more forward, more romantic etc.) without much difference.
It’s odd, especially since I always considered my conversation/flirting skills better than my looks. The few times we actually manage to meet again for a first date, success rate greatly improves and there will usually be a 2nd and a 3rd.
If it means anything, the stares/approaches tend to dwindle in less fun-oriented environments such as in the corpo-neighbourhood where I work or in the gym. Almost as if I was but an object to briefly fantasize about on a night out, unable to elicit any real - even if just short-termed - interest.
This is certainly a major improvement compared to the ‘invisibility’ I experienced on my teens/early 20s and - after TRP - I have had quite some successes in better established circles. However, the above makes night & day game almost useless.
Any ideas or resources you can advise?
[deleted] 1mo ago
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mattyanon Admin 1mo ago
Tricky
Possibly less alcohol too.
This is where all the old school PUA stuff was really good....... TRP says "be hot and it'll all be fine", and this just isn't true.
You need to flirt, build attraction, go backwards/forwards, be interesting, be interested.
If initial interest is high enough that girls approach, there is also a good chance you are doing something fundamentally wrong to turn them off. Very hard to tell what that is without seeing you - what do you think? Are you fun, slightly dominant, teasing, emotionally compelling, interesting and interested without trying too hard?
Lionsmane8 1mo ago
My question is besides your obvious appearance advantage.. are you actually an interesting guy?
Do you have a rich inner world, a rich and interesting life, passions, lifstyle that allows you to suck people into your orbit?
As for girls, do you consider yourself a good story teller? Do you know how to steer a conversation?
whytehorse2021 1mo ago
Are you sure it's you and not the women? Life is not 100% exciting all the time and modern women expect it to be because of hoe-flation. I met a lot of down-to-Earth women in my travels and they're fine even after a lull in excitement.
Vermillion-Rx Admin 1mo ago
Without a doubt your social skills and mastery of basic social norms and natural conversation flow Is probably insufficient and lacking.
I would wager money that you look attractive and competent but then can't maintain the image that you deserve or qualify for the cover image you give upon testing your first impression
You probably don't actually know how to have a normal progression of conversation to plans and probably have awkward body language and mismatched tonality.
Rote memorized game will never compensate poor social flow.
Read the permanent game noob and the autistic alpha and tell me if this describes you
Last_Inquisitor 1mo ago
Thanks a lot for helpful feedback and the link. To answer your questions, does the link describes me? Yes and no.
Did I grow up pretty lonely without a serious circle of male friends? Yes. However - having being involved in political activism and otber silly things - I have always been quite good at holding a conversation in all environments where conversational skills where all that matters (where people wouldn’t worry too much about body language, confidence etc.).
Furthermore, I did already applied many of the suggestions given in the link upon my first contact with TRP a few years ago. Including, in particular, building a circle of male friends and talking to anyone. I did very good at the second one, so much I feel I know already way too many people ij the places I frequent habitually. I did pretty good on the first too, moving beyond my 2-3 ‘socially awkward’ friends and building some good friendship with - let’s say - ‘alpha guys’.
As mentioned, I did also score some ‘considerable’ successes in dating. If there’s a first date, there will almost always be a second. Unless that first already leads to sex, which has also pften been the case. So I wouldn’t consider myself uber-awkard or boring. Just the past weekend I successfully escalated a convo to invite 2 girls back to my. As we waited for the cab with them, I also correctly guessed uncertainty mounting in one of them and successfully deflected it.
True, however, that I remain - deep down - quite insecure. And possibly problem got worse since I got a better shape and more external confidence… since now it seems I bite off more than I can chew (well socialized 10s and 9s as opposed to my usual ‘bit on the fringe’ 7s and 8s).
On top of all that, my text game is awful. Which certainly doesn’t help in re-establishing contact when all you had a chance to get was an IG.
Musicgoon78 1 1mo ago
You've got a lot of work to do my friend. First off you don't want to bore these women. The easiest way to entertain is to go out and do things you like and invite them along for the ride.
Now how is your comfort with your sexuality? I lead with my sexuality. I'm overtly comfortable with my sexuality and I set a sexual tone from the get go. What you lead with, is what a woman will take.
Now part of getting a woman hooked is the ability to paint a picture of what the future with you looks like. I'll need to write a post on this the point is, give them something to look forward to for sticking around.
It sounds like you get initial interest then drop the ball by being bland. Women absolutely despise bland guys.
Last_Inquisitor 1mo ago
Thanks a lot for helpful feedback, much appreciated.
I feel the question on sexuality is spot on: indeed I am not too comfortable with it plus it matches my thoughts after last night misadventures that I should have sexualized further. Indeed a few interactions started with a nice exchange of ‘fuck me’ glances, which I held nice. But entirely possible, due to lack of comfort and contingent situation, I then dropped ball on this. Further suggestions on how to increase one’s comfort, as well as how to keep the sexual tone to the convo would be greatly appreciated.
With this big caveat (my lack of comfort with sexuality) not sure on the ‘bland’ part. I think I am a pretty good conversationalist, good at listening, teasing/negging if needed, describing my different interests and experience with flavour and passion. Ever since getting in touch with TRP, I take women almost exclusively to event and places I want to go to. Which of course made an enormous difference in my results.