A fundamental core principle here is that you are the judge of yourself. This means that you have to be a very tough judge, look at those areas you never want to look at, understand your weaknesses, accept them, and then plan to overcome them. Bravery is facing these challenges, and overcoming the challenges is the source of your strength.
We have to do this evaluation all the time to improve as men. In this thread we welcome everyone to disclose a weakness they have discovered about themselves that they are working on. The idea is similar to some of the activities in “No More Mr. Nice Guy”. You are responsible for identifying your weakness or mistakes, and even better, start brainstorming about how to become stronger. Mistakes are the most powerful teachers, but only if we listen to them.
Think of this as a boxing gym. If you found out in your last fight your legs were stiff, we encourage you to admit this is why you lost, and come back to the gym decided to train more to improve that. At the gym the others might suggest some drills to get your legs a bit looser or just give you a pat in the back. It does not matter that you lost the fight, what matters is that you are taking steps to become stronger. However, don’t call the gym saying “Hey, someone threw a jab at me, what do I do now?”. We discourage reddit puppet play-by-play advice. Also, don't blame others for your shit. This thread is about you finding how to work on yourself more to achieve your goals by becoming stronger.
Finally, a good way to reframe the shit to feel more motivated to overcome your shit is that after you explain it, rephrase it saying how you will take concrete measurable actions to conquer it. The difference between complaining about bad things, and committing to a concrete plan to overcome them is the difference between Beta and Alpha.
Gentlemen, Own Your Shit.
KoolAidMan7980 4y ago
OYS #3
Rebooting and start posting to OYS after LARPing for over a year on MRP. Late to post this week due to Rule 9.
Stats: 41 years old married for 8 years. Wife is 41. Four kids ages 7-16.
Height: 6’1 Weight: 202 lbs 22% bf (calipers)
Lifts: Stronglifts: BP-200 5x5 Squat-185 5x5 Deloaded to work on form, Deadlift-320 1x5 Ovhd Press-150 5x5 Row-170 5x5
Reading: Conversation Tactics, Rational male, NMMNG, WISNIFG—need to reread these 2 again
Fitness—Lifted weights 4 days and 5 HIIT classes. Started reading Wendlers 531 as I start to look at programs when 5x5 starts to stall.
Diet—continue to stay on track with my diet. Scale went below 200 lbs a couple times during the week before hitting 202 today (Saturday).
Health—T came back at 479 ng/dl and Prolactin and estrogen levels all normal. Appointment to see urologist in October to raise my Xyosted dosage to 100mg which is as high as it goes.
Relationship—Made a mistake on Saturday of last week. I got under 200 lbs on the scale for the first time since 2008. Instead of keeping this accomplishment to myself and validating myself, I opened my mouth and told my wife what I had accomplished. I was in a good mood and said we should go out to lunch and celebrate. I knew when I saw her face I had made a mistake by even talking. After a few remarks by her about my weight and bringing up a dumb thing I did recently in front of her friends, I cancelled the lunch and left the house to run errands. Im sure the butthurt was written all over my face a mile away.
I then had a fight with the wife on Monday when I didnt take her to a dr appointment. Appointment was to have a small mole on her neck removed. I was busy doing other shit around the house and lifting weights so I didnt want to take her so I didnt. Encountered two shit tests from this and just didnt respond to either. The first one passed with her leaving for the appointment. The second lasted longer later that day. Upon not responding she asked if I was going to answer her why I didnt take her. I said no. It felt uncomfortable not responding. Like I was being fake or something. It felt weird not instantly responding and DEERing or fighting back. I was then hit with how she cant trust me and that ever since December when I started losing weight that something was different with me and it was coming to a head. I think my lack of responding got to me at this point and I told her she was crazy and that if she was unhappy no one was keeping her here. This set her off at this point that we should get divorced. At this point I threw STFU to the wind and raised my voice and yelled back at her. Any frame I had went right out the window. I left the house and finished the landscape project I was working on as any further talking wasnt going to help me.
I think Ive been trying to get validation from her for so long that breaking this cycle will be the biggest obstacle I have to overcome. I need to trust my own judgment.
Sex—initated two times and was met with hard nos both times. Not even close.
Game—continuing to make small talk with strangers. The progress is slow as I am feeling anxiety approaching people especially women I dont know and talking to them. Have to press through the discomfort.
Goals for the week:
-STFU
-Stay on course with the diet
-Talk to 2 strangers
-STFU
BarracudaRP 4y ago
Read this. If your goal is to STFU, then she will be the next person to comment on your body transformation. You never get to point out your own progress, please inform your ego that it's going to be starving until it dies. You don't tell your wife (or anyone else) that you're killing it, you show her. Unfortunately, you probably failed a second time by canceling the lunch with your wife; you could have gone out with her for salads, but more importantly you could have continued your good mood and mission progress. Instead you let it get diverted by your wife. In the future, your frame will be strong enough to handle this - you don't have to let your day, your mood, or your plans be changed by your wife. Or anyone else.
You held frame on the doctor's appt fight (well, until you didn't), you recognized that it felt strange to not instantly DEER like you usually would. That's the good stuff man, keep chasing that. That's the guy inside learning to stand up for himself, not needing to justify anything. Next you'll be doing the same with breaking your validation habit.
Substantial_Rust 4y ago
OYS 8
Stats: early 30s, 6'6", 225 lb, 12% bf (navy method)
Married for 1, together for 7, no kids
Goals from last week:
Lifted Tuesday, Wednesday, Friday, Saturday, Tuesday
Rucked Friday (4 miles, 30 lb)
Current Tier 1 lifts:
Had a lot of neck pain after Saturday's session, might have done something during deadlifts, or just from sitting on the couch all weekend. I took a couple days off from lifting, instead I stretched and rolled out. Since the pain wasn't going away, I tried using a lacrosse ball on my traps and rhomboids and it (surprisingly) helped. Ordered a peanut/double lacrosse ball to target the area better. Afterwards, I was able to lift without issue. I'm moving to every other day while I rehab the area. I also found a tape measure and have a better idea of what I need to focus on in terms of aesthetics, so I switched out pushups with overhead press. Using the "Adonis index" for comparison, my shoulders need a lot more size (which I already knew, but now I know what to aim for). I stopped running, but my diet needs more attention if I really want to grow.
Updates:
Took some vacation time from work last week and mentally checked out so I could relax. Made sure to wrap things up at work and with my responsibilities before taking the time off. I spent a lot of time with the wife: went hiking, went out to eat and got sushi, played board games, watched a bunch of old movies and shows. Had a great time. Also connected with two different buddies who I consider high value. On the other hand, I dropped the ball coming back to work this week. Extremely distracted all day and at work, reading bullshit on reddit and watching junk youtube videos. Today (Thursday) was the only day I'm actually content with the amount of work done.
General observations:
Realized I wasn't able to answer the introduction questions on the Fraternity's discord. "What is your mission? What are your goals? How will they help you achieve your mission?" I have some short term goals, but they don't connect with any mission. I have been very reactive with minimal planning. I've made some progress and I'm better at putting out fires, but I'm still causing plenty more by getting in my own way. Without direction, I'm just drifting aimlessly. I don't know what I'm working towards.
The other realization, from my readings in MMSLP and watching a couple of the RPU videos, is that I lack abundance. What "options" I do have are bad or non-existent. I'm worried about losing my job, because I'm not sure I could get another one with my current abilities. I have oneitis for my wife because I never go out and meet anyone new. This goes for most of my relationships. Without abundance I can't build real outcome independence or frame, so I'm all bullshit. I've internalized and know that I'm on my own -- this was the realization that lead me back to MRP and to OYS, crawl away from the drugs and escapism -- but I haven't done the work to make myself more valuable. This ties back to my mission, as value is relative. I saw a number of resources posted here on the topic, so I will research this weekend.
Goals for next week:
BarracudaRP 4y ago
Your mission can be like layers of an onion - that was one of my biggest takeaways from WOTSM. Your mission does not always have to be the ultimate, all-encompassing, permanent intersection of your skills and passions. But maybe you can get to that point. This means, you don't have to wait for your mission to be perfect before adopting it. Get one, do it, peel back that layer of the onion and discard it. Then find the next one, which will take you a little closer to the center. In that way, your short term goals can connect with your overall vision, even if it's in the form of eliminating the missions because you achieved them, or because you realized that your mission needed to be adjusted.
Good job not giving up. Good job taking feedback. This part is hard, but you're doing it. Just look at all the guys who delete their accounts out of shame or anger or ego. Keep at it man.
sea-tease 4y ago
Your "General Observations" section is very good. I read back over your previous OYS's and /u/inchargeman and /u/blarg_risen really busted your ass right out of the gate.. Many would quit after that but you've OYS'd every week so you do have that.
It's easy to let those observations paralyze you and your progress. Don't let that happen. It's good to notice them but you need to TRUST THE PROCESS. You are working your way out of those mindsets (lack of abundance, oneitis, fear...) a day and week at a time - just like you're giving up your lazy crutch of weed and alcohol.
On the mission piece, it's fine to identify options and draft ideas but dont force it. Just keep doing the work and it'll come with time. Maybe scrap that piece on your goals for the week and continue doing the daily work.
Substantial_Rust 4y ago
I definitely deserved it. Whether I do it right or fail, I have to keep doing the work and try to do better the next time.
To clarify, I'm not trying to force the mission--as I know it will constantly change as I continue doing the work--but rather align in a certain direction. For instance, identifying what I fear and what I avoid. I will always feel stuck without options if I don't address these.
Thanks for input.
ExactMammoth 4y ago
Are you in a part of the world where you can’t go to a gym? Can you build a home gym?
You will do better barbell lifting in my experience.
Substantial_Rust 4y ago
I love barbell work, actually emptied out a storage unit of workout equipment when the pandemic closed down all the gyms. Sold a rack, barbell, hundreds of pounds of plates on Craigslist. If I had waited I'm sure I could have made more but I knew others could use it more than I could. I just had no room to use it in my small garage.
I'm trying to buy a home with a full sized garage where I will build out a complete home gym. In the meantime, I do have a full set of double kettlebells all the way up to 106 lb, so I have plenty to get strong.
ExactMammoth 4y ago
I misunderstood - So you are holding onto a 106lb kb in each hand when you deadlift?
Substantial_Rust 4y ago
Yes. I'll make that more clear in my post next time. Double kettlebell means the weight shown in each hand
ExactMammoth 4y ago
Nbd. I just didn’t know. 106 lb deadlifts is shit for a guy your size.
Is there a handle or mechanism to stack them together to continue progressive overload?
Substantial_Rust 4y ago
I was going to progress to deficit deadlift first, by standing on 2x4s. Eventually, yes, I was just going to use some straps to tie smaller ones to the 106s.
rightsided 4y ago
OYS #36
Married: 3 years. 3 kids [5,3,2yrs], 1 on the way.
Height: 6', Weight: 214lbs - Target: 187lbs or 10~12% BF
-PRs as of 9/23/2020-
SQUAT: 310lbs x 5 - Target: 350+ x 5~ or 420 x 1
BENCH: 250lbs x 1 - Target: 315 x 3 or 330 x 1
DEADLIFT: 440lbs x 1 – Target: 500+ x 1
OHP: 205 x 1 – Target: 220 x 1
Reading: Principles, “Bigger, Leaner, Stronger”, The Little Book of Stoicism
Health: I hit a new PR on my OHP. 205lbs. 15lbs away from my goal. Then I went on youtube and saw Larry Wheels OHP 4 plates. Fuck. I fell down the youtube natty vs. juice rabbit hole.
Reading the BLS supplement section has opened my eyes. Luckily, I read this section before I bought more supplements, which I was planning to do tomorrow. I'll only add Creatine, and fish oil and, after my current supply of protein runs out, I'll make sure I'm getting more protein-per-gram per serving. Also going to try plant-based protein (pea + rice).
De-loading this week. I went to the gym once and will focus on jumping rope for the remainder of the week. I will start back up the AthleanX BeaXst program on Sunday, this time going for the ‘Total Beast’ setting, which is just an increase in reps/sets and more difficult version(s) of a workout. I went out drinking, and focused on being social/game. Although I had a good time, I ended up staying out too late, missing my train, and having to catch a taxi back to my hotel. I lost control and paid the price for it. Alcohol still has control over me, especially, when I ‘m not held in check by friends/family. If I drink alone, at the bars, I do stupid shit like this. Meditating more and progressing fairly well. Some days I meditate twice a day. Using the ‘Serenity’ app for assisted meditations. Gym 1/1
Alcohol */1
Meditation 4/5
Sleep 6/7
Going Forward:
Reach 199lbs 12/31/2020.
Achieve strength targets 11/18/2020. -in progress
Meditate every day. – On target.
Mission and Career:
Short work week, national holiday and summer vacation. Going forward:
Expand network, skills, and improve social circle. – in progress
This week:
Personal and Family:
So, my gym buddy is a flaker. I thought I had made a friend that could really push me. I think this is a good experience for me, however, as I am able to see that I rely on others too much to keep me disciplined (see alcohol section in health) and push me. Plus, I need to respect the fact that not everyone is as serious as I am when it comes to lifting, or keeping their word.
I (still) rely on others for validation and others’ judgement instead of being my own judge.
I realized I may be past the anger phase. I never really even noticed...
Frame.
Thoughts lately: Frame is not something I ‘do,’ it’s who I am. Ive been listening to ‘Entrepreneurs in Cars’ lately and reading through the sidebar trying to internalize what frame really is and how to live in my frame at all times. Taking charge in daily life helps, as I get the chance to make decisions, be challenged, and learn.
For example: My son started potty training. I was working with him all morning and we were making considerable progress for Day 1. Wife comes along and starts to try to change up things. I moved into her frame
I was open to her input, as I trust her as a mother who, basically, potty-trained my two other kids,despite my gut feeling of “no”. I went against my gut for a brief moment, and the whole thing went sideways-- my son is pissing all over the floor, when, just a minute ago, he'd been going to the toilet with no issues. I immediately went back to how I was doing things.Things worked out, and we’ve had a pretty successful day 1.Family.
My wife explicitly told me I need to praise her more, then immediately hit me with a shit test, that went like this: ‘You don’t praise me enough. Tell me when I do something good, because if you don’t, I may cheat on you when we go to the states.’ What. The. Fuck. Was my first thought. But she’s right. I don’t praise her, show her affection, etc. I must say I now admire the way she can fuck with me. A comfort test that says ‘Please tell me I’m doing a good job,” and shifts to “or I’ll fuck some other guy who gives me the tingles.” I’m not going to lie, I felt like verbally blasting her telling her how hypocritical her statement was, and "if I had said that..." and how fucked up of a thing that is to say, but I just kept my mouth shut. Nothing I would’ve said would have been attractive or strong.
Stoicism readings really helped me this week.
On summer vacation. During this time, I am going to:
Get my youngest potty trained. -- in progress, I'm/he is doing better than expected
Enjoy myself. Working on my hobbies/interests. Finish BLS and Principles. --will complete BLS tomorrow!
Finish up the course I’m taking now for my career change.
Map out, review, and revise mid-term and long-term goals.--In progress
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
Seems youre getting sucked into her frame. Praising her has nothing to do with getting fucked. So shes still dangling that carrot because she knows it works. I'd be more concerned with the other part of that threat, which seems to be drop number one of trickle truth: Your wife wants some American dick.
My wife is absolutely allowed to go jump on strange dick whenever she wants. She doesn't of course, because I'll drop her like a hot potato. But she can't really threaten it if it's allowed. Therein lies the lesson: Don't try and take away her power to hurt and threaten you. In fact, give her all the power to. Because a threat is simply someone grasping for power over you. It's not actually executing that power. If you give them that power, they can't threaten you. And then you'll see just what threats are real, and which are empty.
rightsided 4y ago
Crazy thing is, it really disgusted me when she first said it. I don't know what her intention was when she said it, and I really can't be bothered to care longer than I have to, but I suspect that she knows 1) she's losing her control over me, 2) she probably doesn't feel as hot as she used to being 7 months pregnant and mid-30s, while I'm improving in all areas. To your last point, you're spot on and I also now suspect it was an attempt to put me back in "my place" by threatening to give away my *seemingly* most prized possession -- her body.
My reaction to her bitchiness/moodiness has been to either address the stuff that cross my boundaries or STFU.
I haven't been proactive when it comes to dealing with her mood(s) and, she has not really been on my mind. Part of me feels that I am neglecting her (nice guy?). Then I DEER myself by saying, "Well, if she wants x from me, she knows where I am" or "She should be doing x, if she wants x from me" (covert contracts). My gut says, whatever.
Because of my garbled way of thinking, I just focus on me, occasionally drive-by kiss/slap on the ass, and I have upped the praise.
I realized I needed to praise not just her, but my kids more, as well. So she did have a point when she said I don't praise enough. Praising everyone more helps me recognize the good they do, and I am able to appreciate the little things I used to overlook.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
Be careful with focusing only on you and "not letting things affect you." What your wife said was shitty. You can be offended by that. What you can't do is show it, or let her actions change the go plan. To influence you to act in response to that in a way that reinforces her shittiness IE praising her more because she threatened you (Note if you agree with her opinion there, you can praise her more based on your decision to. Not in response to her threat.)
In addition, you can choose to be offended, and assume what she said, she chose to say, after careful consideration of your entire marriage dynamic, her vision, your vision, and an independent analysis of her situation devoid of emotions...OR...you can choose to understand she likely is lashing out emotionally due to feelings she has RIGHT NOW based on faulty mental models where she just doesn't understand a better way because no one has lead her there yet...and feel sorry for her. (Note feeling sorry for her ALSO doesn't change the go plan. It Just let's you see her situation as unfortunate.)
SBIII 4y ago
Aim for both.
WhiteNight200 4y ago
OYS #18 (Discovered MRP 3/11/19)
This one is mostly a downer. I’ve got to admit where I’ve messed up and learn from it. (I’m late this week due to a ban from a Rule 11 violation.)
Stats: 35yo, 5'9", 168 lbs.
SQ: 265x2
BP: 180x4
OHP: 105x7
DL: 325x1
Chin-ups: 10
Relationship: Wife 34yo, Twins 3yo. Married 12 years.
Mission
Be my own man. Give of my abundance. Share my gifts and talents readily with those who are ready to appreciate them. Be the Oak to those in my care.
Study
Starting over for the third time, thru SteelSharpensSteel’s MRP Guide. u/SorcererKing’s Guide for Career Betas (applies perfectly to me).
OccamUsername’s LTR posts over at TRP (recently unblocked TRP on mobile). Amazing stuff.
Physical
5/3/1 BBB 3+/week. PRs on DL and BP this month. Occasional row machine or recumbent bike for cardio.
Averaging 1800 calories/day, 130+ g/protein. Continuing to maintain weight and re-comp. It would be nice to cut down to chiseled abs, but my three weeks of 1500 calories/day resulted in no progress.
Career/Finances
My company was bought out by a bigger one. Raises have been promised. Anticipating the changes to benefits next year.
Maxed out IRA for this year. Due to max out 401K as well. Advised wife on switching investments and reducing ER in her old 401K. Setting up to max out 2021 IRA in January.
Researched better credit cards. New one on the way. Will cancel old shared one if we split finances.
Personal
Busy and social with church responsibilities, gym, and weekly game night.
Made some new friends, caught up with old ones, and had a great time at my brother’s wedding a couple weeks ago. IOIs from photographer. Threw brother a bachelor party and gave him some literature and advice that I wish someone would’ve given to me.
Read “Magic of Tidying Up” and have cleaned out my wardrobe and library.
Realized I have slid back into blaming others for my unhappiness and have walled off myself instead of engaging. The truth is sometimes I’m still angry inside. I’ve both lashed out inappropriately and STFU autistically.
I’ve lost my vision over the last few months and it has affected most other areas I need to improve, especially the hard ones (socially and in my relationship).
Family
Traveled cross-country with family to wedding. Great time for all.
Kids have started pre-school. I’ve been more patient with them lately. Taking time to focus on some of their weak areas, reading numbers and letters, which they should know by now.
Marriage
For too long I was blaming her again and isolating myself instead of taking responsibility and making things better.
Planned some good dates, set up babysitters, etc., all with no expectation for sex, just there to have a good time. Truth be told, I’m not attracted to or interested in her, and haven’t been for months. She’s offered sex twice (no seduction) over the last six months and I’ve turned her down—I don’t want it with her. At least the Dancing Monkey tries to flirt with and game his wife. And this hasn’t been Monk Mode, either, because I have not been truly engaged in my mission.
Counseling has not gone how I expected or hoped, and has actually accelerated us toward divorce. I didn’t prepare myself for the last session, wasn’t holding my vision, forgot nearly every strategy against criticism and Fitness Tests, and let things go sideways against me. I was honest but pathetic. It was so bad my wife found a lawyer the next morning for an initial consultation. Not joking.
—-
Failure is often the best teacher. I can’t waver on this or let my guard down. I can’t stall, get angry, or be unattractive. Hard lessons to learn.
I thought I could do it on my own, but I can see a lot of benefit from having a Morpheus, as SorcererKing suggests. There’s no one in my circle I can be transparent with. LDS/Christian background would be helpful. u/becoming_alpha, u/alphasixfour, feel free to PM me. There are probably more of you out there willing to help.
Posting in OYS every week will keep me focused as well.
——
As an aside, I want to thank the mods for what they’re doing behind the scenes. My first impression here was not a good one: I discovered MRP, got excited about turning my life around, posted my first OYS, and promptly got banned for mis-posting it. My fault. I got angry for a minute and they gave just barely enough understanding for me to stick around while I cooled off.
Reviewing the mods’ comments on my posts and listening to WNS and HoA’s stream this past weekend helped me see a little better what they’re really trying to accomplish here. My marriage may soon be over but my life is just beginning.
Cloudy_Pirate 4y ago
My wife and I went to marriage counseling about 3 years ago. I think we went to 3 or 4 sessions. Our counselor was a Christian male who specialized in marital counseling and sex addiction (for men). The first session, he told us that divorce was a real possibility and we should be prepared for it. The second session, he referred my wife to a counselor for some of her own issues (separate from marriage counseling). My wife found this referral quite helpful. The third session, I stood my ground and called out my wife on her attitude and actions. She stormed out of the session leaving both me and the counselor somewhat stunned. I can't remember if we went back for a fourth. My wife has requested every 6 months or so that we meet with another female counselor to "optimize" our marriage. I have steadfastly declined.
I have many couple friends that go to marital counseling and many more that are "considering it". I have told every one of them what I am going to tell you.
Marriage Counseling is not good for your marriage.
Women absolutely hate being called out on their shit. They will do almost anything so that every problem is your problem. And the thing is - it really is all your fault. So what can you possibly gain from marriage counseling? You either get another person to agree with your wife that you need to fix your shit (not helpful) or you get another person to agree with you that your wife needs to change (she will not accept this and will insist in changing counselors - and she will be resentful on top of it).
If you think you need counseling, go individually. If there is stuff you need to work on with a counselor, do it. If your wife would benefit from it, support her it getting it for herself.
I will never recommend marriage counseling to any red pill man under any circumstances.
For the blue pill man, marriage counseling will delay the divorce and give him a chance to be a better blue pill husband. I don't wish that on anybody, but many men just cannot unplug from the matrix.
WhiteNight200 4y ago
This is consistent with everything I heard before. I knew the rule, and thought I had found exceptions in my counselor and myself. I was wrong.
2wo2wo3hree 4y ago
And here we are again....
SB & Rian, Men who are doing better than you are trying to shake some good counsel upon you but you’re hyper focused on holding on to “frame” instead of absorbing the message.
Frame is everything, until it gets you the type of stubbornness that makes you think you can head-butt a train heading your way and you don’t care what anybody says.
I commend your good fighting spirit and strong will. You got that. But you might be creating your own problems sometimes.
WhiteNight200 4y ago
First of all, thanks for paying attention.
You’re right. I’ve created my own problems. I listened to advice, tried to get the best information I could, and made a plan. The consequences of that plan (and my failures in implementing it) are on me.
You guys are trying to help me come to the conclusion to just get out. I hear you.
What’s holding me back? All stuff you’ve seen before: The hope that things can improve with my wife and family. The fear of harming my kids. The fear of divorce ($, drama, feelings of failure/depression). The fear of being alone.
There are social pressures, too, but I’m confident I can deal with that, thanks to what I’ve learned from NMMNG and WISNIFG.
SBIII 4y ago
Why are you setting up dates with someone who you have zero interest in fucking?
I smell bullshit.
WhiteNight200 4y ago
Because it’s fun even without the sex. It’s good practice for whatever comes next.
SBIII 4y ago
So you're plan is to spend your future with women who you don't find attractive and who you have no interest in fucking.
Rinse and repeat.
WhiteNight200 4y ago
Clever. I still found some value in it. I know I can do better.
See my response to 2wo below for my honest self-evaluation at this point. Your BS-meter is appreciated.
SBIII 4y ago
Not as much as she did.
RStonePT 4y ago
What fungable bullshit is this? These aren't goals, they are platitudes. Do you know what a SMART goal is?
WhiteNight200 4y ago
That’s my mission, not my goals. Goals are concrete, with numbers and deadlines.
I’m happy to adjust my mission if I come along a better one.
RStonePT 4y ago
Let me rephrase
What does life look like when you've achieved any of these goals? How are you prevented from just post hoc justifying anything you have done to fit with your 'goals'?
WhiteNight200 4y ago
A mission is more abstract, not to justify failure or mediocrity, but to promote you to continue pushing the envelope.
What you’re talking about sounds more like vision, something I’m still working on putting into words. I imagine myself leading a family to a prosperous life, becoming financially independent, maybe retiring early. Teaching my children to live with integrity. Being worthy of and holding respect and gratitude in the eyes of my wife (whoever it is).
RStonePT 4y ago
What does propserity mean?
Have you done the research to have a dollar amount for this?
How early? What age will your income x get you to independence Y which allows retirement Z?
This is important, why?
This is an aside, but making a girl the focus of your goal is a setup for disappointment.
My friend, you can quibble about the difference between a vision, a goal, a mission statement and a TPS report all day long. At the end of the day, I see a man who has filled his life with fuzzy arbitrary goals without any meaning behind them as a rationalization for whatever happens to you being 'part of the plan'
Do what you like, but fuck man, get a fucking clue what that looks like
WhiteNight200 4y ago
Yeah, we’re caught in semantics.
You’re right. Girl is not the focus. I can’t rely on anyone else for support or validation. It’s a vision, something to strive toward. If I can find someone who adds value, great; if not, it’ll be fine.
Financial Independence: $3M would easily cover it, without Social Security benefits. I can’t give you a timeline—have to figure out alimony and child support first.
I’m still not sure what you’re looking for. Maybe you can point me to an example.
RStonePT 4y ago
Just to be specific as much as possible.
It's not like you cannot adjust if it ends up being untennable. But the more specific your direction is the easier it will be to make decisions down the line.
And the less importance you put on the wifeys behaviour
ItsRedThyme 4y ago
OYS #2
STATS: Age - 24, Partner - 25, together 3 years 4 months, H - 189cm, W - 117KG
Bench - 70kg 2x5, Deadlift - 110kg 2x5, Squat - 100kg 2x5
READING: Finished: MMSLP, NMMNG, WISNIFG, The Barefoot Investor, Steels Guide, Stickied posts, Art of Seduction
In Progress: BPPs Youtube series, MAP, SGM
I finished Art of Seduction this week, I think I jumped the gun with this and didn't take enough in. I need to reread this further down the line, at least after Day Bang.
I've also been going through a bunch of FRs and other top posts of all time, it helps in the moment for motivation however I need to read these slower and make mental notes of these things.
Next: Bang/Day Bang or Pook
MENTAL: I am failing 95% of shit tests that I notice, and that's just the ones I notice. I need to slow down my replies and not just say the first thing that comes to my head, listening to BPPs first few videos has helped me identify these tests a bit quicker. I need to action this.
My win for this week was no porn/fap. It's only 6 days but it's something. I haven't felt much desire for my girlfriend. I got home from gym last night and showered for bed, I soft initiated while she was busy on the laptop so I just shrugged and went to sleep.
No work was done on anything else. I am keen to start Day Bang to get an idea on approaching strangers to strike up a conversation.
I listened to the podcast for last weeks OYS and I think it helped my mindset to hear people that have their shit together talk about this in a casual way. It is a different source to (audio)books and that as well as BPP have helped motivate me.
I need to finish MAP and work on mine, there's not a lot of green in my life.
Goals:
No Porn, No Fap**, OYS on time and early,** journal to improve memory, MAPPHYSICAL: 3/3 sessions this week. I skipped the research and decided to go with the tried and true SL5x5.
1 session a week will be with my PT and I will lift max or close to it. This will count as one of the sessions for SL on the app. The other 2 I will work up from 50kg Squat, 40kg Bench and 20kg 1 arm row. I have no excuses to not do this at least 3 times a week. I will do these sessions at night after work to get out of the house and some alone time.
I went for a jog this morning using the 5K runner app. I want to do this at least 3 times a week to help be active and get me moving in the morning.
IF was a failure, I did it maybe 2 days, it is something I did before COVID and dropped 10kg, I know I can do it again.
Goals:
Train 3x a week, jog 3 times a week, IF at least Mon-Fri, -100kg weight.WORK/FINANCE: I reached out to the hiring manager to lock in a time for the interview, it will be later today. I am half confident with getting the position, we had a casual conversation 2 weeks back to talk about it and I think I fit the bill. Lets see.
I haven't been late to work once in the last week. This is huge for me as for the last 3 years I have always been late at least once a week, if not more. It's pathetic.
Goals:
Get to work on time,Lock down the interview, look into a side hustle, increase personal savings.RELATIONSHIP/GAME: Nothing to report, I fucked up hugely on the weekend by motorboating her when I was sitting and she came for a hug. She has been cold since.
Goals: Don't be autistic, Continue gaming and kino, gain OI for failed initiations.
AlphalfaSprout 4y ago
Given you admit you are failing 95% of shit tests and “need to slow down your replies” it is clear that you have decided to wholly skip the STFU phase of MRP. Just stfu. Seriously. Stop replying to shit tests. Just stop talking. It’s not an end game solution but it’s definitely a solution to where you are at. Read, Lift, STFU.
Also don’t skip Rollo. Go on his website and read everything. Read Rational Male.
ItsRedThyme 4y ago
STFU it is. Fair point that all I’m going to do is fuck up my words.
Rollo is on the list, should I prioritise it to BPPs vids?
2wo2wo3hree 4y ago
ItsRedThyme 4y ago
Poor choice of wording I didn’t physically shrug I just said okay and turned over. What would be the correct response in this case?
I’m guessing the issue is that I’m unattractive?
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
You are 6'2 and 257lbs. And your lifts are beginner.
Two-Hundred-Fifty-Seven Pounds.
One-Hundred-Seventeen Kilograms.
When I weighed 100lbs less and lifting for 6 months my lifts were better.
Do you really have to ask that question, Mr. Fatty McFatFuck?
2wo2wo3hree 4y ago
Iron Rule #8 - Always let a woman figure out why she wont ƒuck you, never do it for her.
I’ll add this... while she’s figuring it out... you should be doing something that makes you a better man or something that makes you happy.
Second, well, yeah. You’re a fat fuck, dude. That’s not going to change overnight but don’t make excuses to delay the process.
To close off you’re retardation regarding your motorboating incident... I am not a motorboating lesbian. However, just like others who had some sort of success in fixing our relationships and understanding women, I don’t think we’re going to get the same response as you did if we did something silly like that. If we did, we would know that it’s not about the motorboating. Something else is off.
johneyapocalypse 4y ago
OYS #5 (or 6, I forget)....
Any of you dudes wanna talk to me about gaslighting?
The phrase didn't exist when i was younger, apparently now it does.
I'm not too edgey one way or the other, but if there are some objective dudes - with some objective thoughts - I'd appreciate hearing what you have to say.
I'd never heard of the term before. Now it's come up.
~ja
red-sfpplus 4y ago
You never almost died, you have always had perfect health and anything else are errors in your memory.
Cloudy_Pirate 4y ago
It's actually an old term that has found resurgence lately. It comes from a 1938 play called Gas Light.
The husband tries to convince his wife she is going crazy. Among other things, the gas powered lights in the house dim every night because he is using diverting the gas to light the adjacent apartment where he searches for jewels. He covers his tracks by telling his wife that she is just imagining the dim lighting because she is going crazy.
It's now considered "psychological abuse" and I'm hearing it come up from various marriage counselors. Combined with female solipsism, it now effectively covers everything she doesn't she like in an argument.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Basically lying to someone to make them believe what is true isn't; and telling them they are crazy for believing the truth and manipulating their mind by utilizing their trust in you.
Example: your woman is cheating, you ask her, she lies and says you are crazy and then mounts psychological reasons you are crazy for even thinking it - perhaps even going so far as to suggest you need medication for being crazy and takes you to the doctor for it (in a loving way).
Cho_Assmilk 4y ago
My wife tries it regularly. I'm forgetful at times, so she uses this forgetfulness to try and always be right about what was said. It used to drive me nuts. I'd think "do I fuckin actually know what I said or is she right and I didn't say that?".
Now I just don't care. My frame is too strong and I say "ok babe" or some other two bit phrase to show IDGAF and do whatever I was going to do anyway.
I postulate that many men who come here are being regularly gas lit. If you follow the process of MRP though, it becomes almost impossible for someone to use it on you.
ImpatientZen 4y ago
Same here. One of the big positives of MRP was understanding women and thus learning to trust myself and my memory again.
Anomalousfunction 4y ago
OYS32.
Age 50 Married 24 years. Together 26 years. Wife 48 years. 3 male children age 21,21 and 17..
Reading.
Read NNMG, MAP, WISING, MMSLP. The Game by Neil Strauss and The Rational Male (the book) by Rollo Tomasi. The Art of Seduction. Most recent book: The way of the superior man.
Body.
Height 179 cm/ 5ft 10 Weight 73.5kg Body fat c18%.
Back in gym. Enjoying it. Unfortunately very busy and COVID unsafe when my youngest son goes first thing before school. He spotted for me when I benched this week. Good moment.
My stats which again I know are weak:
Deadlifted 85kg for 5 reps.
Goblet squats with 26kg dumbbell. Need to move to barbell squat. Overhead press 3 sets 5 rep at 27.5kg.
Bench press 3 sets 5 rep at 42.5kg.
Again I realise these weights are low.
Sex.
Interesting incident last weekend. My wife initiated. I was offered doggy which she ‘hates’ straight away. Afterwards I was told the trigger was that she learnt that the male half of a couple we know has been having an affair for four years.
But today back to starfish.
No rhyme or reason. Never mind.
Frame.
Needs work. Letting her mood dominate the house too much.
SBIII 4y ago
What did you do?
Drink a bottle of Covid?
Take a shower in it?
Asked randomers to cough into your open mouth?
RedBackedBadger 4y ago
Why?
who's frame are you in when you say this?
I'm mid 30's and my first priority is not getting injured, yeah it means my weights are much less than they could be and I don't currently squat but they are MY priorities. If someone here told me I need to lift heavier, they would be wrong. In your situation you are 50 and maybe you are more/less focused on not getting hurt. So your weights are low, if that is because you consistently go to the gym and use proper form and prioritize not injuring yourself and these are the weights you can handle then fine but if they are because you don't go to the gym regularly and have not taken the time to learn form/overcome injuries then it will only be you who loses.
So does your OYS - what did you figure out on your own from writing this down? What are you going to do differently this week? u/AlphalfaSprout asked you questions, spend time thinking about and answering these - not just writing the first thing that pops into your mind. What work are you doing? Maybe your first 31 OYS were 100% work - I dont know but this one certainly isn't.
Makes complete sense. She temporarily got the dread from someone else, on some level she doesn't want to lose you, did doggy, then 5min later remembered you aren't going anywhere and she is in control. Back to normal.
Anomalousfunction 4y ago
On the lifting. Been scorched about this a couple of times on this sub. Agree it is for me to judge what I do me and how much. I keep entering other people’s frames. My OYS doesn’t show work or effort I agree. It’s become a journal.
AlphalfaSprout 4y ago
You said you realize your weights are low. What specific steps this week will you be taking to remedy that?
You said her mood dominates the house. What specific steps are you taking to remedy that?
How important is it to you that she initiates and specifically initiates doggy? Why is that?
Does it upset you that there is no rhyme or reason to her change in sexual position offerings this past week? Why?
Anomalousfunction 4y ago
Weights. Been back in the gym for two weeks. Have been reading Starting Strength to understand more about the form and programming. I am working on my form for deadlift, overhead press and bench press. My brain and body can only handle so many things at once. So continuing with goblet squat for now. Today did goblet squat, bench press, back extensions and chins.
I have read WOTSM and I am trying to engage with my wife when she is is a bad mood. A hug. A tease. An activity. Rather than just ignoring or walking away. But if all else fails try and ignore.
I honestly don’t care about her initiating. I realise that the doggy thing is me keeping a scoreboard. I am tracking what progress I am making by what my wife does. I still have an underlying covert contracts and dancing monkey syndrome.
No rhyme and reason. It doesn’t upset me. I am becoming to realise that my wife is not an maths problem to be solved. The logic of push this button this will happen just doesn’t apply. TWOTSM helped me with this.
I take the well made point I need to reframe the way I am writing and approaching Owning My Shit.
AurelianReflections 4y ago
OYS#5 – Next Chapter
Age:30(m) 31(f)
Children: 8 weeks (m)
Read: MAP, WISNIFG, NNNMNG, RM
Reading: WOTSM
Its been a while since my last post. The way my life is now, I need to hold myself accountable to make things better for myself.
New born baby is 8 weeks old. Life is even harder now, and wife isn’t making it easier. Been trying to lead family, but lack of frame. When I do manage to establish frame, its make of twigs.
I’ve been reading ‘The Way of the Superior Man’ this week. Really enjoy this book. Simply written, which makes it understandable and easier to implement. A weakness that I have that he highlights is that my heart goes cold and closed off in reaction to my wife’s behaviour. The superior man does not do this, and lives life with humour and love.
Physical Fitness
I had been working on my strength during the lockdown period and was able to build my body with callisthenic workouts whilst the gyms were shut. I felt great, was building muscle, and my body was looking better. I suffered a bad shoulder injury from another activity which stopped me from being able to workout my upper body. It has 95% recovered. With the new baby, as well as my physically active job, it’s harder for me to find the time and energy to fit in a workout during the day.
Preparing and cooking food is a harder than before. Last night I got home from work to no food cooked by my wife. I’ve had to grab food when I can, and make stuff that doesn’t take ages to prepare. Although I don’t eat much processed stuff, I’ve found that my weight has gone up since the arrival of the baby.
I must try and find time during the day to do something to workout. I’ve found my laptop to be a big distractor me. It needs to remain off more often.
Money
Has not been a problem. I have had less time to track my spending on a weekly basis, but was able to catch up last weekend when I had a few hours to myself.
During quarantine, the family business went into overdrive. I played a central part in the running of the business, and doing all we can to make sure it didn’t fold under the pressure. I have proved myself to be committed and hardworking when the shit hits the fan. As the eldest sibling, I’ll naturally take over leadership of the business one day. The last few months has shown myself, and my family that I am the rightful one to do this.
Displaying Higher Value
I’m too nice. And if I’m not nice, I’m getting butt hurt as a reaction to shitty behaviour.
WOTSM has helped me in the last week. I felt like I was able to establish some frame, but was it ever an established frame if it can go that quick?
Went out and bought some nice clothes. It made me look more attractive, or at least looks like I care for myself better. It wasn’t a whole new wardrobe, but it is a start.
I need to work on personal hygiene a little more. I can still be a little rough around the edges.
Relationship Comfort
WOTSM had a great line that I really need to get in my head. Whenever your wife is in a shitty mood, perceive it as her feeling unloved/unwanted.
I’ve been more conscious of this, but need be the superior man that can show his wife comfort and love when necessary. I can too easily get dragged down into her pit of despair.
Personality and Preference
Fake relaxing was a problem for me before, and still is. If my child is asleep I can too easily go on my laptop and phone rather than muster up the energy to put that time to good use. I’ve found that if the baby is being looked after, I have more of a drive to get work done for my business. WOTSM mentions how spending quality time with my child is far more important than the quantity. I fully agree, as I realise that men are not natural care givers to children. Especially at this new born stage. All females in my family and circle of friends get soft inside and just want to play baby when they are next to him. I haven’t encountered a male with the same reaction yet. My best time spent with my child is going for our morning walks to the park and around the streets where I live.
Sex
Two months since birth and nothing yet. That’s fine by me and I haven’t been pushing it. Have been playful with my wife recently and seen positive reactions, but it hasn’t got as far as any sex yet. It amazes me how much I can get away with, and she loves it.
Area of Focus
I’m going to get back into some daily exercise to build muscle and get the testosterone pumping again.
I’m going to spend less time on my laptop and phone.
I’m going to keep dressing better. Need to get some good trousers.
I’m going to keep my facial hair tidy. Moisturise my feet. Clean my teeth for a full 2 minutes.
I’m going to spend time undistracted with my son.
I’m going to be the type of superior man that doesn’t get butthurt over his wife’s emotions.
​
(Just finished writing this, and I feel a lot better getting where I'm at written down. I now have a base to spring up and forward for next week. Hope to see you then.)
2wo2wo3hree 4y ago
New born baby is 8 weeks old. Life has new challenges. That’s all there is to it.
AurelianReflections 4y ago
For sure. I'm making shit excuses, and there is not excuse for that. I'll stop whining to myself and get on with it.
That negative emotion pit really sucks everything into it. Again, no excuse for it. Its going to be one of my weak areas. I remember when I was younger people used to say I could dish out dirt, but couldn't take any. This is probably a continuation of that.
Thanks for taking the time to read my OYS and respond. Appreciated.
Cho_Assmilk 4y ago
This
Followed by this is too soon. That book is for someone who has frame and understands women. You should read "Practical Female Psychology for the Practical Man" first.
Those are shit excuses. Saying you don't have time to work out is akin to saying you don't have time for yourself.
Meal plan bitch. Cook it all on Sunday's.
No. You're faking it. Keep faking it till you make it though. Eventually it'll just be who you are. You'll stop falling under her shit pressure naturally and she'll accept it or leave. Either way, you'll be in a position to not be a subservient bitch.
How do you go about making her feel loved/wanted?
AurelianReflections 4y ago
I have that book. I'll read PFPFTPM now. I have found TWOTSM to be pretty enlightening, and has been the catalyst I needed to continue my OYS after slacking for so long.
7 day work weeks. That thought did come into my head earlier today. I don't really like the idea of planning, cooking and refrigerating my meals a week in advance. But I'm not sure if that excuse is a good enough reason not to do it. I could definitely make a few meals in one go and store it better.
So TWOTSM tells me to embrace her. Make her feel my masculine energy. Things like that. When I notice her in a shitty mood, I playfully ask her if she needs a kiss. This usually will crack her up. She may agree/disagree but either way i'll hug her and give her a kiss.
Today before leaving I lead her onto the sofa, bent her over my knees and spanked her bare bottom. No complaints. She went from nagging to playful in seconds.
Thanks for taking the time to read my OYS and give me criticism. I need it.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Cringe.
I'm a dude that has read TWOTSM 40+ times. You're too early to understand the lessons.
You don't "ask" her if she needs a kiss. You pick her up, spin her around, kiss her on the lips hard, slap her ass and move her - physically - from mood to mood. If she will not open into a new mood you DO NOT push into her more.
You are needy.
AurelianReflections 4y ago
Thanks for the feedback. Yeah it does sound cringey reading it back.
I think i've attempted to be less needy this week, however I'm still a beta faggot, so I'm probably still fumbling about.
I've been listneing to your OYS review on YT. You said you didn't get many requests last week. If you'd like, you can destroy me on my latest OYS.
red-suppository 4y ago
OYS 1
I am on my second wife. I thought this relationship was ruining my life and making me unhappy. I now realize that I have been unhappy long before this relationship and it has all been my own fault. I am sorting out how things got this way and I am turning my life around. I'm here to work on myself.
Mindset
I have been going through life with zero self-awareness. I am in the process of reflecting on the major events in my life to try and understand them for what they really were.
Books
Read: NMMNG, MMSLP
Currently reading: MAP, WISNIFG
Plan
I am working on my two main red areas (physical #1, income #2) until I finish MAP and create a plan.
Physical
I set up a home gym last week and I just started Phrack's Greyskull LP program. I plan to stay in a 500 calorie deficit until I reach 10% bodyfat.
BF: 27% - Navy method
Lifts (pounds): Bench 155x8, Row 175x10, DL 225x8, Squat 165x11, Chins 15x5, OHP 95x5
Income
I am currently at home taking care of my children until the lock down is over. I am networking and preparing so that I will be able to easily land a job when the time comes.
Ubermensch33 4y ago
Vague platitudinal descriptions of your life are a waste of time. You have to be vulnerable, dude. If you're wondering how things got however they got, maybe start with the fact that you're afraid to anonymously share details with strangers on the internet that you will never meet. Or that you're too lazy to do so.
sea-tease 4y ago
There's hardly anything here. No personal stats either. Age, height, weight...
Your mindset section. A waste of valuable time. You are where you are regardless. Get busy on the basics of rebuilding you. Stfu, lift constantly and read starting from the beginning. As you progress like a man, you can revisit your past but just get busy for now. $10.00 says this is your only OYS...
LARP_No_More 4y ago
OYS #5
Stats
Age 36. Ht 6'8". Wt 176 lbs. BF ??%.
Fiancée 28. Together 3 years.
Lifts
Strictly bodyweight fitness atm
"Assisted" BW pull-ups 8x3 -- bulgarian split squats 8x3 -- "Assisted" dips 8x3 -- Single leg "deadlift" 8x3 -- BW rows 8x3 -- Incline push-ups 8x3 -- Athlean-X ab routine.
Read
NMMNG, WISNIFG, TWOTSM, TRM#1, MAP, Extreme Ownership, MMSLP, top 50 MRP posts of all time
Adjacent books: What Women Want When They Test Men, How To Win Friends & Influence People, Atomic Habits, The Obstacle Is The Way, Practical Female Psychology
Reading: Book Of Pook
Mission
To use my talents to the fullest of my ability. To be a man of my word, a man of the world, and the man of the house.
After six months of my industry being shut down, I'm finally returning to work this week. And as my typical work day is twelve hours long not counting lunch, commute, and overtime, that means nearly every part of my life is back in flux. I've been doing this line of work for nearly fifteen years, and I've never gotten good at figuring out how to live consistently amidst the unpredictability. But now more than ever I have the desire and the drive to finally make it work. I'm going to have to work hard at it but I welcome the challenge.
I'm trying to be better about recognizing the progress I am making and not being too hard about not exactly meeting my goals. Yes, I still want to set high standards for myself, and yes, I still believe in the importance of setting goals, but I need to find that line between acknowledging where it's going right and making excuses for not improving, and make sure I'm on the correct side of it.
Physical
Good. Feeling like some of the exercises are getting less difficult so I must be making progress. I moved up to Bulgarian Split squats and boy I am finally feeling it. Should've been doing those to begin with.
Gyms are still closed. Before Covid, I would try to lift after work, but that left little time for sleeping, and no time for my long-term projects I might want to spend an hour or so on. So I'm aiming to do my bodyweight stuff during work. I'll try it out this first week and adjust as necessary. It'll be difficult as my job isn't something where I can just walk away from my desk for 5 minutes at a time or something, but I'm going to try. Bought a set of resistance bands to assist in getting the most out of it while I'm there.
My weight went back down but I forgot to measure bodyfat this week. Fail.
Mental
Anxiety was higher this week. I already know what causes it so it's not a matter of trying to get to the bottom of some mystery. Meditating is working. I'm really enjoying it actually. When I meditate it does help get the anxiety to a manageable level, but it's still present enough that I distract myself with bullshit rather than focus on stuff that needs to get done.
I'm going to try meditating in the car for five minutes at the end of each work day.
Sex/Relationship
I feel like I got the first sense of what the future might be like for me this week. Fiancee shut down sex in the middle of the act yesterday. Said her stomach was hurting which then segued into how she wasn't really feeling it from the beginning, how she thinks her libido is low, and that she's afraid I'll leave her because of it, etc. Old me would've showered her with comfort and praise. Instead, I tried to give the appropriate level of comfort while trying to stay out of her head and STFU. I reminded myself that this is how she feels in the moment. (She was PMSing after all.) But I was firm in that I will not be okay with a low-sex relationship. Didn't go Rambo (I don't think), just was honest.
I always was thankful that I found MRP when I did and not twenty years into a dead bedroom. But this was a wake up call. A reminder that I am no different than every other guy out there, and she is no different than every woman. This is something that takes lifelong effort.There is no goal reached and then you stop. I may be working on my physique, but game still matters. Dread still matters. I'm sure my not having a job for half a year wasn't exactly helping things. But whatever. The big picture is what counts.
A few hours later she came onto me and we fucked properly. She said she was feeling better mentally. There it is -- her feels in the moment.
Part of my "conditional schedule" is to make sure she gets an allotted time of my attention when I get home from work, and stick to that time. For too long I've lived in her world and hung out for hours to make her happy. If I want to spend more time with her I'll do it, but the time must be made to allow for everything else that needs to get done when I come home.
Work/Career
As I said, I'm returning to work. Usually, I most of my work is taking gigs. They usually last one to three days, but I work on average three or four days a week. The two jobs I'm about to take should last about ten months straight, about five days a week, lest there are any more Covid shut-downs. This will be the longest span of continuous work I've had probably in my whole life. That I'm working so consistently every week will make things easier, but with my long days, I have to figure out when and how to spend my few precious hours I have at home. That's where the conditional scheduling comes in. "If this, do that", etc. I've spent my whole adult life just winging it when it came to scheduling. That won't fly anymore.
Butt-in-chair time was better this week, though not as much as I'd like. Lots of progress to be made here, but I am in a better place than I was before. I can acknowledge that while admitting I have far to go. But again, going back to work means maybe an hour a day to work on career stuff, if I'm not physically and mentally exhausted. But 45 minutes of butt-in-chair time is better than no time at all. I might have to switch to a different project given the circumstances.
Gonna be a lot to figure out over the next two weeks.
arm_candy 4y ago
What the fuck is an assisted bodyweight pull-up?
threekindsoflucky 4y ago
Rule 9
Ubermensch33 4y ago
May be ban worthy but where the hell are the MRP rules? I've read all the sidebar stuff and don't see them. Are these just the TRP rules?
Cloudy_Pirate 4y ago
In the browser, they are part of the sidebar. In the reddit app, it's in the "About" section right next to moderators.
​
1.No Concern Trolling
2.No Shaming
3.No Moralizing
4.Rule Zero Violation
5.No Solicitation
6.Lacking Self Control
7.Own Your Shit
8.No Value Added
9.OYS Violation :: "She" Doesn't Matter
10.OYS Violation :: Whining About 3rd Party Actions
11.Failure to Maintain Standards
12.Shitty Advice
Ubermensch33 4y ago
Ah I see. It appears on new reddit on the sidebar (browser), but not old reddit.
FWIW mods I don't see Rian's videos on new reddit sidebar...I do see them on old reddit.
new reddit
old reddit
Jupi_ter 4y ago
36YO, wife 38YO, 1 kid (6)
Lifts (5x5) - SQ 160, DL 195, BP 130, OHP 100, ROW 110
Height: 6’2’ Weight: 181 Pounds
Goal review at bottom
Readings: Everything in the Sidebar except 48 Laws and SGM. Several multiple times. Current readings: Bigger Leaner Stronger.
Nutrition
Food… I’m thinking about food a lot. Since October 2019 I have been practicing Intermittent Fasting and progressively reducing caloric intake. I lost a good amount of weight (I did not get shredded) and learnt to do without food for long periods, which can be very handy. But… I’ve been a sad cunt for much of the time this past year.
I brought my food intake up again in the past 2 weeks on the recommendation of u/impatientzen, because he rightly pointed out that if I want to look good, changing my body mass composition will help me a lot more than trying to lose more weight. Bulk.
I looked at what 2,700 calories amount to and thought “there is no way in hell I can eat that”. I still struggle with eating that much, I do feel too full for long times, and my bowel movements have become annoyingly irregular.
But… I have a level of energy I practically forgot I can possess. I feel like I did in my 20s. I’ve always been a high energy kind of person, that has always drawn people and opportunity to me, but when I look at my journal/OYS from the past year, it’s clear that it’s just not been the case.
When I started noticing the different level of energy I thought it must be some psychological breakthrough, or just some chance, I even thought it was down to my telling my self: “I need to reconnect with the mad side of my self that was so active in my 20’s”.
Maybe there is some of that, but most of all, I think it’s as simple as putting the calories in to allow my metabolism to return to a happy level and some more.
I’m writing all of this because it’s important to realise the deep consequence of screwing up nutrition, which I strongly feel I have. It also highlights to me the importance of needing to research how to make cuts short and efficient.
General
Work is my focus right now. It’s taken over most everything. I have the energy for it and the motivation. For now that’s just what it is. I will start to rebalance in October.
Meditation continues to be off track, I’m struggling to bring it back because of the high energy state and not feeling like a need it, but that’s none-sense. Discipline…
Not making time for reading, again discipline.
Relationship
Nothing much to report here. My level of attraction to my wife is not high. I don’t feel like initiating. I am warm and affectionate, I game naturally as it happens, but I’m just not sexually very focussed on her right now. This is probably a good thing because sexual oneitis is what has been holding me back a great deal.
At weekend I was eager to finish a social engagement to return home and spend time with the family, and that was great. Prepared a BBQ for us, had a bottle of wine, good music. I felt fantastic.
Mindset
Last OYS comments helped me internalise something basic, but important. You either have game, good game that flows naturally from a state of abundance in the world (calories, lol), or you have material objective dread through good beta and alpha. Ideally, you have both.
But when you are not gaming and your dread is non-existent/weak, forget about sex. Forget about it, and don’t get hung up with anyone but your self.
I know, I know: “Be attractive - it’s fucking simple Jupi_ter, what’s so hard about it?” Nothing except really accepting it. “I’ve been on MRP for yearsssss - this cock ought to be handled, and well!”
I pray I allow this moment of clarity not to dissipate, but also that I don’t overthink it, overthinking this is a nasty trap.
Past week goal review
This weeks goal
September month goals are:
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
You fucking pussy. I ate 3300 calories a day and I was 6'0 and 140lbs. Yes, it's hard. But if I can do it, you can. I hate eating. Don't be a pussy.
Go eat a pizza.
xxxthrowmeawayxxxx 4y ago
thank you. you're a hero.
Jupi_ter 4y ago
Cheers
Cho_Assmilk 4y ago
I call bullshit. 2700 calories is so easy if you eat calorie dense foods. Make sure you hit your Kcals and don't be scared to add some carbs to fill the void.
But if you really can't force yourself to eat it, again I call bullshit, then try micro dosing thc/cbd edibles. Eat a little less than it takes to get high and your appetite will go through the roof.
johneyapocalypse 4y ago
Don't put all your hopes in your body and/or percentage body fat. You're fine - though clearly skinny.
Regarding this:
Do you recognize that you're giving yourself an either/or proposition, failing on both, and thus excusing yourself from either?
This is pure escapism.
Your mind is not so simple as perhaps you'd like to believe it is.
Jupi_ter 4y ago
I'm not following you. Do help me understand, honest request.
I used the *second person because I found it good to narrate the idea, but my point is specific to my marriage and how I failed to internalise the meaning of creating attraction / being attractive and my responsibility over that.
I’ve been following the program but have also been lazy, particularly around game, sort of like: “Look i’ve upped my clothes and now wear cologne, are you going to start fucking me?” which is a poor mindset (and a CC). I had an instance of getting butt-hurt and someone calling me out on last OYS made me realise I’m still making this mistake from time to time.
For a different take, I see what is the mindset I have when I want to seduce a stranger, all the right moves fall into place fairly naturally. With my wife there are still too many expectations and not enough game and calibration (of sexual tension).
I've had a few months this year where I've been able to lead my wife to more intimacy because I put less pressure on her, relaxed, and gamed naturally.
That worked, being more attractive will also work. Going to the gym per se, does not work. That’s what I’m getting at.
I look forward to feedback. Thank you
ImpatientZen 4y ago
My experience has been the same. Now you are skinny with a bit of blub you can't just mindlessly cut. Getting kcals right matters and bring in a deficit too long does a number on your head. That said Johnny is right. Just eating a bit more is hardly panacea so channel the energy right.
As you increase calories it is IMPERATIVE you also progress your lifts every week. I don't particularly like SL5x5 but whatever has you doing compounds with progressive overload and actually follow it is fine.
You will need to do BB style bulk/cut cycles in all probability. For now gain 2-3lbs bw/month and add to your lifts until you stall. This shouldn't be for at least three-four months if you do it right.
Jupi_ter 4y ago
I will read the book you suggested in October. For now, I'll stick with 5x5 because "autopilot". I expect to plateau at 240-250 squat, 3 months from now. That's where I got stuck last time. I don't know what to do once at a plateau, but I have time to figure that out, for now just stick with the basic work.
I was going to ask you what should be my body weight gain target, and you've answered that, thanks!
ImpatientZen 4y ago
Autopilot is great for workout/diet as long as the plan isn't retarded. Changing course too often (aka program-hopping) derails most. So just commit to this, as it seems you have.
The beauty of GSLP (IMO) is actually how it handles resets. So using a high volume approach like 5x5 until you stall and then switching over to something a bit lower volume but higher intensity and autoregulated like GSLP could probably work really well.
Don't expect to plateau, it mentally holds you back. Just do the program, one workout at a time and see what happens. Besides, muscle memory is a thing, and you are in a caloric surplus, too.
Jupi_ter 4y ago
Thanks for the reminder "expected limits" mindset. You are right it's self fulfilling.
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I remember the first time I squat more than 100KG I was shocked I could do it. But I spend way too much time not doing it because I thought it so...
SpareTireBob 4y ago
OYS #8
Stats – 37yo; HT 5’-10”; WT 185 lbs; BF% 14.7% (navy method)
Lifts – DL=351 (1RM), BS=333 (1RM), BP 217 (1RM), OHP=136 (1RM)
Relationship - wife 33, married 11, together 14; 4 kids (all under age 10)
Read – NMMNG, The Rationale Male Year 1, MMSLP; Currently - The Daily Stoic, WISNIFG
Week Summary Life has been good – the last week felt easy. I concentrated on being in a positive mood and not over-analyzing situations, something I’ve had trouble with in the past. Being fun with my wife and kids isn’t as difficult as doing it at work, however, I made progress in both areas. Things seemed to fall into my frame and time will tell if it’s actually progress on my part or it’s just coincidence. I was able to get away for some quiet time alone to just be in my thoughts which also proved to be helpful. Although I feel things are working well, I know I haven’t arrived and there is much more work to put in.
Physical It was a scheduled de-load week in my lifting program (5/3/1), with the lighter load on main lifts, I hit the assistance work with a slightly higher intensity. I found some much needed heavier dumbbells in my parents basement (my brother left them behind when he moved out of state) – they’re mine for now and saved me from paying an arm and a leg.
Besides that, looking into cutting back my running for the colder winter months and incorporate more lifting. I’m currently doing 3 days a week, sometimes 4. I’d like to get that up to 4-5 days a week. Running is likely holding back some lifting gains. Aesthetically I look good, but in reality I know my lifts could be better if I concentrated on them more. I look forward to the work in getting bigger.
Relationship It was a fun week, I stayed in a good mood all week and made it a little more unpredictable and interesting as I broke some of my routines I had previously with my wife. Mostly, I had fun with life and my relationship benefited from it. Sex was good, no rejections. As it feels like life is on easy mode right now, I know that I cannot get complacent as I’ll be tested again. For the first time, I look forward to the challenge, to be able to put what I’ve learned to use, and to gain experience. This is a journey and I’m going to enjoy the ride.
Reading I got back into WISNIFG, little by little. I also started digging through old MRP posts and absorbing that material – something I felt like I couldn’t get enough of. The reality is that there is so much to read and I need to pace myself – again, a journey.
Social I was going over a few of my first OYS’s, and this came up a lot. Simply, I have no excuse - this needs work. It’s my weakest point and the area with the greatest potential of growth. This hasn’t been the best year to try and improve my social life, but there are opportunities that I am neglecting.
Conclusion I want to thank W&S and HOA for the OYS live stream. I wasn’t able to watch either of them live, but did watch the one from 9/12 and am about half way through the one from 9/19. They’ve giving me an even better understanding of the concepts and how they apply to each of us. That being said, it’s been awhile since I’ve been called “creepy”, so thanks for that as well.
threekindsoflucky 4y ago
Life is easy and you're happy as long as you're getting the sex you want. I've been here before. The sex will likely dry up again and there's a good chance your attitude will change with it.
All I'll say is be careful. If you find your mood dropping off if/when sex decreases, you'll know there's a fault in that mental model.
SpareTireBob 4y ago
I agree, I'll watch my mood. I'd like to think I've made progress, but time will tell.
Trondheim77 4y ago
"OYS#19 37, wife 35, together 16 years, two toddlers
FITNESS 6'1, 181lbs, BF 20% (skinny fuck with love handles).
Squat 5x5 195lbs Deadlift 1x5 260lbs Bench 5x5 155lbs Press 5x5 105lbs Row 5x5 165lbs
Got my braces. Not as bad as I thought it would be. A bit of a bitch eating though. So might as well try a cut, se how that feels. (My life contains a lot of "might as well":s. Not really in the spirit of taking charge of your life but hell, you have to be flexible too. At 20% BF a cut was long due anyway.) I'll keep up the protein intake but aim for about 400 less daily calories than my current maintenance level.
MENTAL Read: NMMNG, WISNIFG, MMSLP, MAP, TRM, Pook, BPP, WotSM, SGM, Unchained man, Subtle art of not giving a fuck, Models, Mystery method, Atomic habits, Ego is the enemy, Power of now (50%), Six pillars of self esteem, BiggerLeanerStronger
I have been catching and aborting most impulses to deer or engage the last couple of weeks. Stepping up the "no" game, and lately I have noticed that the fetch quests have actually diminished somewhat.
Have also been catching myself yapping to her about little successes in my life, a gig landed, a new lifting pr, a soreness that's gone... stuff like that. Reeks of validation seeking and needs to stop immediately. Time to STFU more.
RELATIONSHIP Some normie sex and a boob job. Nothing of interest really. No fapping for what must be months now. Sometimes after a few too many rejections the urge comes creeping. But I get disgusted by the very thought of being that kind of loser again, so I obstain. And the effects are mainly positive.
Went on a family weekend where I totally failed to lead. Wife planned it all and I was just a passive, fumbling butler the whole trip. A painful reminder of how my life was every day before MRP.
CAREER Didn't get the job I applied for, which means I'll need to step up my business. I'm working on an updated website, should soon be ready for launch. An old important customer have mentioned jumping ship. I'm preparing a meeting with them where I will make an attempt to keep the gig without selling myself short.
threekindsoflucky 4y ago
You know it is ok to share the wins right? As long as the motivation behind doing so isn't for validation, you've nothing to worry about.
Trondheim77 4y ago
I'm afraid more often than I'd like it's validation seeking and/or just to "have something to say". I'll try to keep it to myself more for a test period to see how it feels.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
I think that, in my case, there is always a hint of validation in sharing wins. So I think like OP does. So, when you share a win, what are you thinking about why you share it? Isn't there always a little bit of "look how awesome I am?"
Ubermensch33 4y ago
There is no "completely altruistic" act or gift. Ego or validation is present in everything we do. We take these things too literally. As I see it, the point is to move away from 100% covert contract to something far less than 100%. Saying "don't seek validation" or "put your ego on the shelf" are just shorthand.
As far as sharing wins specifically, I see a difference between:
"Sweetie, I got a big promotion today, don't you think that's great?!?"
"Sweetie, I got a big promotion today, I feel fucking amazing and all my hard work has paid off. I could smash the world right now."
First is validation, second is sharing your (newfound) energy. It brings others up with you instead of sucking something away from them (validation).
Of course in both we appreciate validation from those we care about. Again I see it as just moving away from that, not totally getting rid of it. YMMV
threekindsoflucky 4y ago
This is a better explanation that I could give.
Trondheim77 4y ago
That sounds like a good distinction to keep in mind. And sure, moving in the right direction is good enough. I don't expect to ever completely lose the need for validation, nor would I probably want to.
threekindsoflucky 4y ago
I am aware it doesn't fit the 'mrp' mold. I talk about things I find interesting.
My thinking is as simple as 'hey, this is cool and I'm interested in it'. There are wins I don't share. And it's not part of some plan to intentionally not to. I just don't find them interesting enough to talk about.
It's simply a non issue for me.
JCX_Pulse 4y ago
09/22/20 OYS #43
34 5’10 185 11% BF Separated
READ: NNMG x3, Subtle Art x2, MMSLP, MAP, 31 Days to Masculinity, SGM, TRM, WISNIFG, TWOTSM, The Unchained Man, The Book of Pook, The Obstacle is the Way, Ultimate Alpha (waste of time), Let Your Inner Alpha Loose, Alpha Male, What Women Want When They Test Men, Find Your Path, Open Her, As you are
READING: Millionaire Next Door
Lifts:
Signed up for a new, better gym this weekend and put in 2 quality work outs. I lifted 5 times this week and ran twice. I had lifting and running under my goal list, but now that gyms are open that shit is automatic. My nutrition is off and I’m not eating enough to support my activity level. As a result my HRV has been awful, as has my sleep. I believe I’m pushing too much cortisol right now as my body adapts to my new workload. I’ve made adjustments to my diet to account for the increased workload/activity level and am monitoring changes.
Social:
Social was pretty shit this week. I hung out with garage gym homie but I was pretty solitary overall. I’m going out of town next week for a mini vacation which will boost my social, but this week will probably be quiet.
Financial/Career:
I made some extra money this month but am also over budget. I should meet my savings goal, but buying a plane ticket impacted my numbers. After reading Millionaire Next Door I’ve completely revamped my savings goals and how I prioritize my purchases. My net worth is below what it should be based on the author's formula, and with the stock market taking a huge shit my numbers are even worse. I wanted to buy a new car as a post-divorce present to myself in 2021 but I may delay that until 2022 and focus on my 5yr financial plan.
Career is tracking. I hope to be getting a promotion next month, but that seems to be in flux given some issues with my management structure. I’m working closely with my mentor to continue to guide my progress in my company and talked to my Sr. Director about his philosophy around his team. He told me how much he loves talking about that kind of thing and wants to do it again.
Mission/Goals:
Last Week’s Goals:
This Weeks Goals:
Mental:
I had an epiphany this week thanks to some AskMRP posts. I finally put together how my leadership (or lack thereof) affects relationships. I finally see how my ex became the shitty person I was when we first got together because that’s what I lead her to. It was a sobering moment to look at where I am in life now because of the decisions I’ve made (or not made) and how being afraid of responsibility has lead me to fuck me over. It’s humbling to recognize that because I was a huge faggot during my entire relationship I essentially raised an ultra-faggot to dethrone me. Women absorb so much of you. They look up to you like children and blindly follow your lead, so if you don’t have your shit together, you’re just fucking yourself over. I know there’s a post out there along the lines of “your woman is your greatest creation”, but having it all click for me was...well, let’s just say I have renewed focus on my goals and a better understanding of their importance. It also makes me feel empowered to know how much my leadership can have a positive impact on my relationships and how I can guide women to be what I want them to be for me.
This week also marked a change in how I deal with my emotions. For the first time, perhaps ever, I persevered through shitty feelings in the beginning of the week and still did the tasks, work, whatever it was that I needed to do, despite not wanting to. This actually set my week in motion by proving to myself that I don’t have to be a slave to my emotions and I’ve had a huge upswing in productivity ever since.
I did a lot of thinking around mental toughness and the whole saying “Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.” I think we have it so easy today we have to manufacture challenges for ourselves or we shrivel into weak and pathetic pussies. I think my life is too easy, and I have to make an effort to create challenges in my life that push me to reach my potential. I like working out, I’m good at it, I’ve done it for 20 years, so the challenge isn’t there in the same way running is for me. I suck at running. I hate it. But it’s also incredibly fun at times. It also pushes me mentally more than lifting weights does. My 7 mile run Saturday was a mess. I wore the wrong socks and by mile 2 had blisters on my heels. I bled through my socks and into my shoes, but I didn’t stop. It was very hot, I didn’t have water, and I took a wrong turn so I ran an additional mile I hadn’t planned on, but I didn’t stop. Not the challenge I wanted to manufacture for myself, but the result of being pushed so hard and seeing what I can accomplish is exactly the type of thing I need to continue to believe in myself and grow my confidence. I need more of this to help my mental fortitude.
I listened to most of the YT Live HOA and W&S did on Saturday and felt it was extremely valuable. I think a few things I took away from the talk were: Don’t try and chase some “MRP Ghost”, this really hit home for me. Hearing the guys talk live gives a different perspective on what challenges they face and how we’re all still on the journey. They may be further along down the road, but there isn’t an end. It made me consider more about what to include in OYS and how the way I write reveals exactly how I feel about myself. Also, the McDonald’s dollar menu has the best calorie per dollar ratio.
I’ve been catching myself thinking here and there about wanting to date again, but for the wrong reasons. Instead of wanting someone to add to my life, the reasons why I want to date again are to fill some void(s) I have. Fucking aside, I know I’m not ready to date again until I know that I only want a female because she adds value to my life. I don’t want to go back into the dating world with the same insecurities and leadership failures that lead to my divorce. I haven’t been single for longer than a few months since I was 19 or 20. I need more time to be alone and build my life the way I want it, though I do feel the pressure of aging. However, I’m still a faggot sitting in a paper-thin frame. Until my frame is unbreakable, I will just repeat the past.
Cloudy_Pirate 4y ago
The physical was never a problem for you, it was always the mental.
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I think is hamstering reasons to avoid rejection until your mental models are "perfect". m They never will be. Quit second-guessing yourself and get out there. Catch and release or whatever. But you need to get out of your head and go out and practice.
JCX_Pulse 4y ago
I am hamstering. I want to avoid having to open up. I'm not worried about rejection, I'm feeling anxious about getting close to someone again and having to feel vulnerable, aka get hurt, essentially.
I do think catch and release is the best thing for me to do right now. At the very least, it's good practice for when I am in a better place to date.
2wo2wo3hree 4y ago
JCX_Pulse 4y ago
I think a lot of men do, but I'm glad you could find some meaning in it.
TheActionNerd 4y ago
Do you strongly believe in monogamy? Why does dating = add someone in your life and fill a void? I guess your point is that you don't have the right mindsets to date yet but if you can treat dating casually I think you should do so. How will you build an unbreakable frame without some challenge?
Having oneitis for MRP just gets you flaired.
JCX_Pulse 4y ago
I do strongly believe in monogamy, but have no issues with dating multiple people in a casual setting, at least on principle.
I think about this a lot. It's like being a personal trainer with hundreds of certifications but never training anyone. I might have a ton of book smarts but how am I suppose to apply it without every being in the position to.
I wrote and deleted a lengthy explanation that is better suited for my therapist than for MRP, but the question lead me to a good realization. I'm unwilling to be vulnerable with or get to to anyone right now. I feel it is unfair to anyone, regardless of the seriousness of the relationship, to only be a toe deep.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Maybe one day you'll see the journey IS the challenge and being able enjoy every minute of it. In fact, the challenge of wanting to handle challenges as they arise in a calm, collected "I got this" manner become the actual challenge. Not the goal of finishing some retarded run you started.
It doesn't take cold showers, knuckle pushups, and bleeding socks while running to challenge yourself. Those are all external challenges when it's really your internal core that is seeking freedom.
Breaking through challenge is at the heart of every masculine man's core desire.
You remind me of myself in OYS. Might be worth a read to get another perspective and understand that your mission is the only challenge you really are after here. Because you know what? You won't ever hit the imaginary finish line on a worthwhile mission.
JCX_Pulse 4y ago
I started to respond to this, but had an existential crisis and went to the gym instead. I think what you're saying is a little over my head right now; just beyond my understanding. However, here's take two.
This:
And this:
You've said so much here it's difficult for me to respond, but I feel I need to in order to better understand myself (and hopefully what you meant).
In one sense, RP is an especially challenging journey for me as I break out of decades of social programming that got me to where I was 2 years ago (joining MRP). I enjoy the challenge of the journey, even when it pushes me to the limit of what I think I can handle. I don't think I'm at the point of enjoying it yet, it's still a lot of work, but I understand through your posts what it looks like when you enjoy the challenge of it (in reference to a relationship).
The part that's fucking with me is the "internal core seeking freedom" bit. Knowing how I feel when I read that makes that statement even more difficult to sort through. Is my mission wrong? What's holding me back? Are the physical challenges I'm imposing on myself distractions to cover up some other issue?
For the sake of brevity I will re-read TWOTSM and see if I take more from it a second time around with a focus on "freedom" in the sense that you and the author are talking about.
Now that I've been properly fucked, I suppose it's time to evaluate a few things in my life.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
I'm doing nothing but sawing away at a nerve that you've felt for a while. It's only now become painful because you realize that it might just be a real thing and not a figment of your imagination as men share notes.
Most guys, when they are able to stop projecting outward challenges (like the MRP journey and "winning") believing that they are internal ones all along, finally begin to look inward and see that it is empty there. The external challenges when nearly conquered give way to a deeper core desire.
This throws you into an existential crisis because you realize, on the inside, you're daft of any real mission, meaning, and everything you've ever done has been manufactured challenge in the form of an external challenge to satisfy your internal core desire for challenge.
What you're experiencing is called the imaginary finish line. You've nearly made it there... you have confidence any external challenge that arises you can likely break through into freedom, and there is a voice inside of you saying "Is this it? Is this all there is to it?"
Yes, it's probably time for a 2nd read through. The first time it doesn't make sense. About 6-9 months later guys are ready for it.
Focus on the blending your desire for freedom and the understanding of your desire for a fulfilling mission that supports an everlasting challenge that leads you to freedom.
From there you will discover the journey is inconsequential in a good way, and it is enjoyable to a higher purpose of mission - whatever that is to you internally.
Yes. It is an elaborate charade to cover up your core desire and mission. It is a siren that tempts you back to something familiar and achievable in your mind.
Don't listen to the sirens, Captain. That's a new challenge for you.
The masculine grows through challenge.
JCX_Pulse 4y ago
So after you Morpheus'd me into a mental coma yesterday after some deep thinking, this was the result.
This maybe hit home harder than anything else you said. Yes, you are sawing away at a nerve, and breaking down a wall that's protecting my ego (?) from having to accept that I am empty inside.
My previous, let's call it "purpose", which is generous, are built entirely on external factors. I don't feel fulfilled. I haven't in a very long time. I experimented by volunteering, by starting a small side business (which generates 0 income because I suck at it) and kicking my ass physically. None of that has done anything for my core self except be a rice paper façade over the real issues.
I started TWOTSM round 2 last night and you were right. I think I read through it the first time just to check a box. This time around I had to stop almost once a page because the introspection that occurred was intense.
I'm at a point now (again) where I have more questions than answers. Last time I was here wasn't that long ago, April or May, when I decided a side business would be a good way to create a purpose. Now I'm back to square one. I'll use TWOTSM as my roadmap for now and use it with the intention of helping make things clearer for myself.
I appreciate your feedback. This is why I OYS.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
You're welcome.
I prefer the audio version of TWOTSM. It's nicely broken down where the chapters take 8-15 minutes to listen to, then reflect. Plus the voice narrator is fucking perfect and he nails it. Sounds like a big ol' wise black grandfather is there giving you the lessons of life.
Yes, you're right. Finding your mission shouldn't be difficult, but when you've layered it with years of ego you must peel those layers away day by day to have it reveal itself. But there should be something you can point to.
What is the source?
What is the source of all these things you have been creating?
What is the source of all the hardships you manufacture?
What is that source trying to tell you?
What over-arching message is it trying to send to you?
I don't share my mission here at MRP because it's very personal and complex to me and well... I just don't need to. But I will share a piece of it here with you, and then maybe you'll understand how mine works and it will give you another man's note to compare your own source to.
I spend a lot of time here at MRP helping men discover who they are. I once taught a kid how to lift. I find ways in my life to share with others what I have learned.
I also spend a lot of time creating external challenges (like you) on purpose in my life so that I might discover what my next true gifts are. The journey itself becomes rewarding and fun.
All of this has zero to do with any internal ego whatsoever (even though my ego may be present in external challenges - it can be used as tool), and is part of the journey & challenge of discovering my gifts to this world. All of that takes time - giving and challenging - receiving and discovering myself for what those things are. And you know what brother? One day I'm going to run out of time. I want to discover as many as I can.
You could say that my first mission is to know who I am. What I know already is that I am a man of freedom. Thus, I give away everything I am without fear.
_________________________________________________________
So, in closing - you really only need to answer one question to discover what that purpose is underneath all that ego:
Who are you?
JCX_Pulse 4y ago
So if we peel back the onion, here’s what we have:
-My physical challenges are a way to soothe my bruised ego after being cheated on and left. They are for my ego to prove to my ego that I am everything I say I am or want to be.
-This just demonstrates I’m not over my ex when the drive that I feel to do things is to prove her wrong (for leaving me).
-This results in me not living a free and authentic life. I’m living chained to my ego, my ex, and a prison of my own design. This leaves me unable to open myself up, fully, and thus, never be able to truly share my masculine gifts with the world. Those gifts are too wrapped up in pain and anger.
-In order for me to live free, and thus open my heart to find my mission and live it to its fullest, I have to remove the pain, anger, and ego from my innermost self, face the fear of being vulnerable to emotion, and live “recklessly” for myself instead of for someone else.
-I know who I am, but I’m not happy with who that person is.
MRPDark 4y ago
OYS #1
Stats: 35y, 180cm, 73kg, BF 18%
Relashionship: Wife 37y, 2 kids (5&2yo), together 9y, married 5y
Books: NMMNG (70%), MMSLP, WISNIFG
This is my first OYS post so I will describe more of my previous state as a reminder for myself. I discovered MRP approx 4 months ago in some bullshit article criticizing MRP. Article did the exact opposite of what author planned, forcing me to create an account and starting to read forums heavily. From the very first moment I was hooked.
Bio:
I was (and still am, no BS) text-book NiceGuy to the bone. Calm little fella, trying to be friend with everyone, a bit scared of crowds and raising my voice in the group. I was always the one asking "How are you doing?", interested in every aspect of people's life and under the covers being hurt that I wasn't asked the same courtesy back. The same was/is with my marriage - prince charming, loving his wife whose friends envy her husband. So far I was relatively happy until our first kid was born. Both our boys never stay in one place, sleeping below average and quite soon we are running on fumes. Sex frequency fall to zero and even I tried hard as fuck quite soon it felt teribly distant. Tried listening podcasts about marriage, tried to better understand women's orgasms, talked more, you get the idea. Result - nothing helped. At this point my MRP journey started.
Social:
Here is probably where I lack the most right now. Since my fatherhood I broke pretty much all my social connections. I am focusing on having at least one proper social interaction talking about life with my friends from the past. Last week I arranged a small meeting of my old friends from my old theatre group but everything failed due to covid stuff. Instead of being quite pissed about that, I just told myself fuck it and moved on.
Relationship:
Even before discovering MRP I had a pretty good relationship with my wife. We share the same sense of humor and core ideas which are important for a long strong relationship. After reading initial books I am noticing some comfort and shit tests, but it's really minor stuff compared to other situations I have read in the forum. Since my shift I am not asking for sex, I am finally initiating and discovering how STFU can change her "honey, I am too tired today" into sex night. It's far from ideal (a lot of effort is still on my side) but it's a progress. Last few weeks I have also noticed a decrease in my sexual desire. Right now I am explaining that as break from my own "life/sex validation". For now IDGAF and leaving that in an unimportant zone. Regarding my frame I had a lot of work to do, many times I just caught myself how I lost a frame, said sorry when it's not necessary and all those niceguy contracts I have been using for years. Here lies my biggest challenge, to unfuck the last 20 years of my beta-life.
Strength:
Starting march with covid I have rediscovered running as a way for losing weight. With MRP in my mind I am shifting slowly my focus on my upper body. I am right now capable to hit the gym once a week, the rest I am doing cardio (4-5 km) and own-weight workouts (expecting lockdown quite soon). I am quite new to this so my primal goal is to get used to it (6 times a week) and work with my injuries (elbow and deltoid muscle is pretty fucked up since day-one). In this area I decided to take it a bit slow, in my own paste, one step at a time.
​
Work:
Since my first job, I have been a hard working workaholic. After reading NMMNG I am focusing on setting proper boundaries (paid by the hour) and working less. After quite a few setbacks in the last few years I finally re-priotized my life and family over my work. My boss knows very well my value for the team and the company so some decrease of my effort is more than tolerable. Right now this area is more than fine without additional effort.
​
Mental:
After reading NMMNG & WISNIFG I am clearly seeing how wrong I was in my own mind. It will take quite some time to unfuck those previous 20 years but slowly I am seeing some progress. Right now I am feeling finally on my own path, heading for a better result one step at a time. Everytime I look at somebody I am constantly evaluating my recently gained knowledge. I have lost weight (8kg) and receiving compliments from my wife and lady friends but more importantly I am finally starting to like the guy I am seeing in the mirror.
​
Goals:
Longterm Goals:
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MRPDark 4y ago
Your question really struck me and leave me wondering, thanks man.
My honest answer is, till discovering MRP I have never felt it.
After reading NMMNG I better understand what I was doing. Creating a mental model of some goal I choosed because I felt it's what I am suppose to do (study university, find a women, have kids). The best part is that I now I know that there is noone to blame but me. Nobody told me that I should do it, I decided that.
After achieving all those "goal of others" I told myself what't next. So I decided that it should be "to be happy". But now I see more how this was just another useless lie to myself. Being happy is vague goal, it has no clear steps and it just calms you down, nothing more.
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MRPDark 4y ago
I don't understand what I should pick and explain. Does this relates to your question about feeling like a real man?
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MRPDark 4y ago
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HornsOfApathy 4y ago
This is how you do an OYS #1. Good job here. On point, talking about yourself only in your perspective. I think you're going to be able to do the hard(er) work first: changing your mental models.
You are 5'10 and 160lbs. You are too weak and skinny, even at 18% BF. You need to focus on lifting heavy weights, stop the cardio bunny bullshit, and lift. No excuses. It will bring the non-mental things into more clarity as you see the results. The fat will still burn off but you will be adding muscle at the same time.
Thanks retard feminists. Watch what they do, not what they say.
MRPDark 4y ago
Thanks man, getting feedback from you means a lot.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
You're welcome. Go lift.
darkaeonforce 4y ago
OYS #10
Late 30s, 6’3" 202.3# BF 18% (Navy - tested 8/10/20) Married 8 years, Children: 4
Sidebar reading: MMSL, NMMG, WISNIFG, Pook, BPP's book, Rational Male 1, Rational Male Preventative Medicine, Practical Female Psychology, TWOTSM, and SGM
This was a better week. I have a long way to go, but finally I relaxed, more emotionally disciplined, and shut the hell up.
Physical & Health:
Current Lifts (9/21/20): (Stronglifts) Bench 5x175#, Shoulder Press 5x110#, Squat 5x175#, Deadlift 1x5x270#, BB Row 5x155#
I have now hit limits on all lifts, but deadlift. I am ascending again on squats after the big deload. I will keep pushing with 5x5. Hopefully with improved sleep and recovery I can push the limits. If that doesn't work I will follow the program and deload. I want a program with more volume (particularly upper body). Continuing no alcohol and no coffee for this month.
This months goals:
1) Continued from last week: "Really STFU. Focus on this. Stop looking for support from wife. Stop reacting to criticism. Keep it simple with STFU and fogging. Do not engage in anything heavy. Keep discussion light".
There was plenty of helpful advice last week. Instead of trying to pack in as much MRP content into every nook and cranny of the day, I took my foot off the gas to focus on things that I enjoy. I worked out, spent [virtual] time with old friends, watched basketball, and dug back into music. I wasn't perfect, but I was employed emotionally under control and more of who I am. I didn't feel guilty about that.
I still felt the frustration of failure in my relationship (from feeling needy and not attractive), but it didn't stick around or overwhelm. Discussion was kept light and was even fun at times. Outside spending time with the kids, I was happier to spend time alone than with my wife.
2 & 3) Work through BFE. Work through my u/AlohaMaui808 question answers specifically spending time on my perceived faults.
Worked through 7 of the first 10 BFE. I am having difficulty picking approval-seeking behavior to stop doing. I feel like most behaviors are items I want to do, but should be doing them because I want to rather than for approval. Reviewed my perceived faults. Added and deleted some. I have to make some sustained alone time to really work on what I don't like about myself that I will accept and what I will work on changing.
4) Guided Meditation each night. - 7/7
5) No Porn - success
6) Average >7 hours sleep nightly -
Averaged 6 hours 59 minutes. Improved sleep this week with only one night of less than 4 hours sleep. The big difference I believe is getting my new bed set up and sleeping on my own.
7) Stay a step ahead by planning ahead - family, work, and self
I was more disciplined in that I accomplished more of my personal goals this week, plenty of planned tasks, and organized family meals/outings. This area could use some improvement as I found it difficult to keep up or stay more than a day or two ahead of time.
AlohaMaui808 4y ago
Why?
darkaeonforce 4y ago
I wasn't sleeping well in my bed, either getting to sleep or waking up and not being able to get back to sleep. When it was happening, I would eventually get up, read, and sleep on the couch. There certainly was that "brain on fire" thoughts that even guided meditation couldn't calm down. I was also waking up my wife and it was pissing her off, too. I also do shift work so I work random nights, so a separate sleep space is useful for day sleeping. I just made the decision that sleep is a major priority right now to help me reset and it's not like anything is happening in the bedroom at the moment.
AlohaMaui808 4y ago
So instead of focusing more on and buckling down on unfucking the mental shit that's causing your difficulty sleeping, you've decided to set the precedent that you and wife don't need to sleep in the same bed.
I hope it ends up being worth it, but I think this is you giving up on facing that she isn't interested in fucking you, being intimate with you, etc instead of experiencing that pain and coming to terms and acceptance if it.
This looks like avoidance behavior
darkaeonforce 4y ago
You and others are pointing out what should be obvious to me. I am running away from the pain and seeking comfort by avoiding the issue. I responded above to SBIII and Tyred.
You are right. I fucking hate that fucking bed and I hate fucking lying there... lying there in my own shit.
I hoped that the sleep (and space) facilitated un-fucking my mental shit. I thought "doing what I need to do to make my space to get my head right and solve my shit" was the right frame. I continue to make weak moves in other people's frames.
Tyred_Biggums 4y ago
Sleeping next to his wife causes him anxiety (butt hurt) for not fucking. Therefore sleep elsewhere.
100% avoidant.
Never leave YOUR bed. If she wants to sleep elsewhere then she can go do so.
Bigfootinmouth 4y ago
During my worst anger phase I laid awake all night sweating like a pig, cursing my wife inside. Her sleeping fine next to me just made me more angry. It went on like that for a week before I got a handle on it. The sooner you get a grip on your emptions the better. Prioritise it!
ImpatientZen 4y ago
I lived that for more than a year. Still isn't perfect. So I totally understand the desperation but really - everyone here is on point, based on my experience. That burning platform/bed is a gift. Don't waste it. You will really do the work because you have no choice.
Waking her up is fine. First of all, frame and stuff. Second it might actually cause some constructive friction/dynamic, at least it seemed to in my case.
darkaeonforce 4y ago
I appreciate your input as well as the consensus opinion. It's comforting to know that someone here has gone through this and come out the other side.
I see that I am treating the symptoms rather than treating the disease (my shitty mindset/Frame/emotional control) - like using paracetamol for a pneumonia. It felt like a catch-22, though....fix sleep which will help me fix myself or fix myself at the disadvantage of less sleep.
ImpatientZen 4y ago
This is a false dichotomy your mind sets up to allow you to sneak out of a difficult situation. It seems you have identified it now - with a bit of help.
You can flip the script. Actually it is a good thing. The system is working. Being grateful for having this indicator light was quite helpful to me in managing it. Maybe it will be for you, too. I got an input to an OYS that might help you, too.
I wont go into details but I was basically not sleeping for a long, long time. At the same time work stress was through the roof. One thing I learnt was that the studies are true. You can actually do OK without much sleep. I learnt somehow to manage sleep deprivation and break my mental models of bad sleep=bad performance, mood etc. So that's an added benefit for if/when it hits again.
I know the drama your head conjures up when you wake up 2AM and can't sleep again. But out in the real world, the fact is that you'll be just fine. Figuring that out is pretty valuable.
SBIII 4y ago
You moved out of your bed?
AlohaMaui808 4y ago
No shit, this was the only thing I want him to expand on this week. There's a post that just came up about being autistic that immediately springs to mind...
darkaeonforce 4y ago
Yes, I did. Temporarily.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
It must be so much easier to avoid the problem by creating a new one daft of leadership.
darkaeonforce 4y ago
I know it's far from an ideal solution and one of last resort.
SBIII 4y ago
You let a woman force your out of your own bed.
Let that sink in.
darkaeonforce 4y ago
You are right. It's a weak as fuck move and essentially a retreat. I rationalized it was a tactical retreat to allow me to reset, work, and make gains in un-fucking myself.....but it's avoidance of the pain (that forges the change)
Tyred_Biggums 4y ago
What’s the ideal solution?
darkaeonforce 4y ago
The ideal solution is that I sleep well in my own bed.
The ideal solution is that I un-fuck myself so that it doesn't matter where the fuck I am and can sleep soundly and comfortably with nothing external (like my my relationship or my job or my insecurity/self-hate or my inability to face my own issues/problems or my lack of vision) keeping me awake. The ideal solution is that I face my problems and solve them.
Ideally I would use that time awake in the middle of the night (or day) to put time into reading, learning, solving, and slaying my dragons and the sleep would solve itself. I was trying to stop the bleeding as I was not performing mentally, emotionally, or physically when I was supposed to be awake. I weighed this versus the weakness that is leaving my own bed.
You and others are pointing out that this was a Beta Shit Goblin-level rationalization and avoidance mechanism.
You are probably right. I thought I needed to run away to reset and start making some gains. Probably chopped off my own dick in the process.
AlphalfaSprout 4y ago
OYS #14
Stats
Age 32 Ht 6’0”, Wt 180.0 BF 17.3%, Wife 32 Kids 2 under 6
Reading
Finished: NMMNG, MMSLP, WISNIFG, Rational Male, Ironwood Alpha Moves, Pook, Ultimate Texting Guide for Men, Bang
Currently: Way of the Superior Man 60%, MRP Wiki.
Physicality and Health
Lifted and played racquetball a lot this week. Hit my various goals front last week on this front. I continue to be skinny fat. Two solid months of lifting after a decade plus of being a chump will not be enough. Continued progress on 5x5 StrongLifts while working in volume work on accessory lifts. Will help with transition into more volume-based workout sessions once I stop seeing gains on StrongLifts.
Again, I snacked too hard on the weekend, but less than the previous weekend. I have to do a better job with the snacking. We usually smoke up on Fridays and that is where the munchies hit me hard.
Goals: Workout 3 times. Racquetball 1 time. Ab workout two times. IF throughout week. Lose 1 pound.
Relationship and Sex
Interesting dread-related story this week. I left to go to the gym unannounced while wife was taking a nap. Get a text of “where are you?” about 20 minutes in. I respond ten minutes later “at the gym.” Get home and see that my iPad has the “Find My iPhone” app installed. I ask her about it. She tells me she was worried about me when I left and checked on me. I smiled to myself and didn’t say anything in return. If this isn’t passive dread, I don’t know what is. The funny (not funny) thing about this is that when our relationship was heading towards divorce earlier this year, one of her complaints was that I was controlling.
Why is this bullshit story important? Because all I was doing was going to the gym. I had absolutely no ulterior motives other than to lift some heavy weights. The hamster did all the work. Working on myself got her all worked up about me. It’s a thing of fucking beauty and I would have never guessed it was possible without MRP.
Shark week: wife initiated a BJ and HJ. After my epiphany regarding sex for validation, I just have not been obsessing over it. It’s a very nice feeling. It makes me feel more in control of myself when I am not putting sex on such a pedestal. Control over myself and not seeking validation through sex does wonders for my frame. It’s the first time I can say I feel a change in whose frame the relationship is in.
Goal: Have fun.
Mental
Every week, I feel closer and closer to destroying the part of myself that seeks validation through sex. As that need decreases, my Vision becomes clearer. I am working on a real and actual MAP, not the dancing monkey version I was writing in these OYS threads the first while.
With that said, I still get bouts of anxiety, being unsure, moody, lacking in frame, wondering what the wife is thinking, being insecure, etc.. But while the anxiety and thoughts were crippling earlier this year, it feels more controllable now.
These past few weeks have been the first time I have started actually understanding and realizing what Vision and MAP are. I tried faking it in my earlier OYS's, but I knew it was all a dancing monkey routine. I absolutely knew that every part of my MAP had the mental structure of "if I do this then she will think/feel/want/be horny". This is going away and it is liberating.
I finished Bang by Roosh V. This was the first book that I read that was/is more obviously catered to the TRP crowd. Some of the book was a little outdated, but it was actually a very helpful primer on things like KINO and approach. It also was helpful to read it to bolster the "Stay Plan is the Go Plan" mentality that is important to outcome independence.
I have a very busy week at work coming up but I do have the goal of expanding and continuing to dwell on my vision and mission. The real one, not the dancing monkey one.
GOAL: Keep reading, lifting, growing. Work on my vision so I can solidify my MAP.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
This is exactly what new guys should take away from STFU. It doesn't mean literally, and the reason it works is that it makes her hamster run. "At the gym" no more. And then not getting defensive and understanding what her snooping meant?
Man, you hit a home run on this, IMO.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
I'm sniffing out massive validation on the fact that his wife "cares". This huge story is a non-story. And personality I'd be a little annoyed if my wife tried to install trackers on me.
If I want to go somewhere...im gonna go. If she has a problem with not knowing where I am, she can say so. If I care about her feelings on that, I'll let her know next time. If I don't, I expect her not to start going psycho on me. If she does anyway, I start considering the impact of this clear red flag on my relationship.
threekindsoflucky 4y ago
Yeah this guy is way to pleased with himself that his wife tracks him.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
Maybe you did better at OYS 14 but I didn't. For a guy only a few months in, this was a home run.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
Read Rian's OYS response laying into another poster. The numbers don't matter. There is no timetable and where you should be. Then ask Horns (and my daughters), I as a leader, will always hold up the end goal as a contrast to where you are. Is that being a crab in a bucket? Is that being someone to inspire to be? I guess it depends on how ego invested you are in your progress ;)
keepingittogether20 4y ago
OYS 28
38y.o. 6'0" 188 lbs 20.3% BF (Navy Method) Wife 34y.o. 5'11"178lbs, Married 11 years, now separated, Kids 9(m) 5(f)
Reading/SB
NNMNG, MMSLP, King Warrior Magician Lover, MAP, Poon, The King Within, TWOTSM, Pook, Rational Male, Manly Marriage Revival, Practical Female Psychology for the Practical Man, WISNIFG, BPP- SLSM, Youtube Archetype Videos, Tons of Athol Kay & Entrepreneurs in Cars. Pinned Sidebar + Links within those.
Now Reading: Bang. I gamed my wife well in the beginning, and stopped completely once we got married. None, no game given.
Physical
Strength
Day A: BP: 145x10, 3x 195x7, 145x12, DL: 3x 195x5 Tricep overhead w/45lb plate 3x12
Day B: Pendlay Row: 3x 100x10, OHP 3x 100x10 Squat 3x 100x10, Shoulder fly 25lb plates 2x8
Plank 1 minute daily
50+ hits to punching bag with each workout.
Body weight squat and hold 30 seconds daily
Diet
Another Good week with meat, vegetables and seasonal fruit. I mixed some Greek yogurt and high protein granola in to the rotation.
Hygiene
Trimmed my beard, keeping the bathrooms and kitchen clean. Cleaned out the dining room that I was using as a staging room, cleared all clutter from the living room and made the downstairs look great. Deep cleaned the downstairs bathroom, Made more progress on the garage. Scheduled my haircut, kept my car clean, kept the house
Style
Bought new socks, paying attention to different styles to determine my next shirt purchases- I need to up my cool and cold weather collection.
Fat
Did good again with no junk food, and keeping up on replacing midnight snacks with bone broth.
Goals
Pull the trigger on a shirt.
Mental
I set up my home office fully in its new space. I am able to both work and sleep better when those spaces are not combined.
I am staying up too late. I continue to be in my head. Shit sucks right now, and I caused it by piss-poor leadership combined with a bad attitude. I am thinking of lessons from the past so I don’t repeat them. However, this allows me to produce during the day.
I consciously keep shifting back to the abundance mindset, but I find myself needing to course correct my thoughts too often. I am guessing this will get better. I am reading, watching videos, and doing. I am also being very quiet and stoic about everything, which is out of the ordinary for me.
Mission
Short Term: Get my house in excellent condition. I am close, and need to continue without stopping.
Goal: Create and hold frame at every moment. Continue to seek out my long term mission.
Family
My kids are doing well, but don’t love the situation.
I have kept them busy, and continue to set a good example for running a house, staying on a schedule, and staying productive. I could stand to play with them a little more, and will do that this week
Goals: A solid hour each of playing, provide solid leadership
Social
I planned a poker night, which is happening Friday and also made plans for Saturday night.
During a trip to the park I was approached by a HB7 there with her son. Our kids were playing and I chatted with her like I do with any of the random parents there. After a second, I recognized her voluntary disclosure from WISNIFG (she is recently divorced) so I volunteered that I am recently separated and led the conversation from there. She definitely threw out IOIs, and I made the decision that while I enjoyed the validation, that’s all I wanted out of the exchange. She lives around the corner and is there often, so if I change my mind, I will see her or a thousand other women there.
Goal: Fun Friday and Saturday nights
Career
Not much new, putting some people on the chopping block, which I don’t particularly like, but it’s necessary. Business is booming and there are a handful of people who don’t care. There are enough hotshots looking for a job. I’m working hard to stay focused.
Worked from home 3 days last week, will repeat that again this week.
Finances
Part of my clean-up was taking back Home Depot returns from wrapping up the projects. $780+ back: score
Goals: Stay on budget, be conservative in my approach.
Purity-Of-Essence 4y ago
OYS13
49yo, BF 20%(picture). Weight 87Kg, 191lbs
Married 17y. Been together 24. Career beta. 3 teenage kids
Lifts
Singles Kg/lbs BS 105/231, DL 108/238
3x5: BS 102/223, BP 63/139, P 49/109
TSSS set of 5
BS 103/225, PC 60/132, OP 60/132
knee and shoulder pain so pushed up the OP and PC and rested BP and BS
Read
Fountainhead, MAP, MMSLP, Poon, Pook, NMMNG, Lots of Sidebars of MRP, askMRP, askTRP, TRP.
Since last OYS: Undercover sex signals, 12 Steps to last longer in bed.
Listening
Lots more youtube content from Rollo, Rian, black label Carl, BPP (red pill coach)
Horns and JA's review of last weeks OYS was good for me, because it put voices and intonations to their words.
Mountain biking
Not been out with my mate, but done a lot with sons, and a lot of bike repairs. There is a world wide shortage of bikes so we redid everything: brakes, chain, cables etc.
Work
This is going very well. I trying to get ahead and really to do a great job, not just a "good enough" which I have done in the past.
Covert contract
I've done all this work and we're still at once a week. Not starfish, but not pron star either. I have this CC badly where I'm getting annoyed because I'm not getting what I want. What a f*g.
Question
How do I internalise these behaviours? If I think about A&A, or treating her as a little girl, it works, but I tend to revert to nice guy as soon as I get a shag?
threekindsoflucky 4y ago
This has no substance.
ExactMammoth 4y ago
You didn’t get anything out of the mountain biking section?
2wo2wo3hree 4y ago
OYS 14
Books: Sidebar, NMMNG, MMSLP, WISNIFG, TWOTSM, MAP, POOK, TRM, 48 Laws of Power, Can’t Hurt Me.
Currently read: The Science of Trust. 80%
SUMMARY
I’m better.
STATS/LIFTS
36yo, 6’3, 204lbs, 15% body fat.
Squat: 225 3x10
Bench: 225 5x7
OHP: 145 3x8
DL: 315 5x5
Bent-Row: 225 5x5
I’m rearranging my lifts. I scaled down from the heavier end of what I’ve been lifting (-25 to 50lbs) to focus on form, tempo & hypertrophy. At least that’s what I’m telling myself. The truth is as the weights get heavier the less I look forward to going to the gym. My solution for that is going up to the 8-12 rep ranges to keep it enjoyable for me. The upside is my heart rate is higher, time under tension is longer and I feel better.
Relationship: I’ve been married for 5 years. I am two years younger than my wife. I have a 4 year old kid in my marriage.
MENTAL:
I’ve been denying it for a while but I might be one of few men whose “family” is their purpose. I wasn’t always this way. I recently felt the pull and I’ve gone against it because it makes me feel inferior that I don’t have this huge life mission, but I’m beginning to come to terms with it. My purpose was always service to country and people.
Although I didn’t chase wealth, I managed a couple of careers, I have a home in my name, and I’m living financially comfortable. My calling has always been service and it’s taken me all over the world. Ending my military service led me to more service. I entered an essential career field that I still love; however, Im beginning to feel like I’ve given so much to others and I’ve exhausted “feeling good” about it.
I found this out a few weeks ago at the beach. While on vacation, I rescued a child and her mother from being swept away by a rip current after I heard a faint cry for help in the water. I went on with my day at the beach like nothing happened. Meanwhile, my visibly anxious wife who saw it all kept wanting to know where the mother and daughter went after being taken out of the water. She wanted to find them and see if they were ok. When she asked why I don’t care to know, I said people disappear after you save their lives. They’re gone forever. Nothing happens after that. Just like that, folks... I realized that serving doesn’t do it for me anymore. It’s time to move on. It’s time for me to bring my service to myself and to my family; until a new purpose comes to life.
MARRIAGE/SEX/FRAME
Still maintaining the fundamentals and not really thinking about frame too much. The only effort I’m consciously applying is projecting the right feelz. I suck balls at it. I feel idiotic when I don’t give the feelz I’m very capable of providing or when I’m hung up due to vulnerability and/or empathy issues. Coincidentally, on a re-listen of TWOTSM, I picked up something I can/should run with. I realized I was all heart, no spine before MRP. I transitioned to all spine, no heart with MRP. I have progressed quite a bit since then. It’s time for me to calibrate and find a “heart + spine” balance.
The only thing to report this week is that I got sick with a cold and sore throat. This is the first time I’ve fallen under the weather since the power dynamic shifted in my marriage. The old me would have complained about what hurts, what sucks, and what I needed. This time around, I delegated during my slight absence. I told her what I needed for the house to operate while I kept myself away to contain my cold. No issues.
Sex and desire is still high. I initiate when I want to, but for the most part she’s the one chasing me around like a horn dog.
SOCIAL:
This was dead too because of my cold. It’s almost shameful to sneeze. I’m on the tail end of it. I’m going to try to bounce back socially next week.
FINANCES:
Still good here. As soon as payday comes, I have the freedom to pay all the bills and put money away in savings. The rest is just play money for the family. This was an issue before I took over the finances.
Progressive Maintenance:
Validate and Provide comfort
Ubermensch33 4y ago
Just make sure what you're calling "heart" isn't a covert contract disguised as empathy/love. Easy to fool ourselves.
I'm especially skeptical that pre-MRP you was "all heart" in a genuine way. I know I wasn't.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
I like this idea of "all spine no heart." I realize that this is my problem; I am hyper focused on spine. I need to read TWOTSM again
2wo2wo3hree 4y ago
I think a lot of us hyper focus on what was lacking. That’s fine. Problem is we are blind to our progress. The sparring partner is tapping out but we don’t release the arm-bar and help them up.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
OYS 32
Age: 50 Wife 50. Married 19 years. 2 kids 16 and 10. 5'6" 148.
Lifts
170 bench (proficient) 265 deadlift (up 10- proficient) 100 OHP (up 5 intermediate) 170 squat -(back down to novice, still)
Doing BLS but am adding one extra set to most of the big exercises as I am starting a bulk. I am deathly afraid of it going badly and gaining back mostly fat. So I figure working out harder will help.
Diet
Nine weeks of cutting at 1300-1500 calories. Loss of 3.5 pounds. Last two weeks almost zero loss. Not good enough. I cannot cut lower and maybe I fucked it by being too aggressive, or didn't calculate TDEE properly and it was higher than I thought. My guess is I just need to get bigger and my legs need lots of work because of my hip issues. i need more muscle as I am probably tapped out on how low I can go without more.
OTOH I am below 150 still and lowest BF in decades (13-17 depending on method). So I'm going to do a bulk up to about 170 pounds. Then cut back to 160. Then re-evaluate.
Plan: lift days: 2500 calories to start 45/35/20 C/P/F. Basically a 300 calorie surplus and add each week as needed.
Rest days 2000 calories 35/35/30.
Relationship and shit
Now that I righted my ship and plugged the leaks, and my FO is coming along, the next area to work on for me is rewarding good behavior and withdrawing from bad behavior, i.e conditioning. Watched Rian's recent video on MMSLP and it was a big help.
I am paying attention this week and wargame some responses throughout the day. Wife has been shit testing and I pass by STFU or AA. But I am withdrawing attention after that. She almost always acts predictably by coming to me after a while and asking "are you cranky (our old code word for "mad"). I always say no and go about my business but will not actively engage her for conversation, just matter of fact logistics and business, for a while. Then I am back to normal. I can always change course if needed, but so far so good.
Leading/Big Picture is still going well. Wife is really coming along with the new me. Without boring you with details, here is an example: this week she wanted me to do x. In the past she would have flat out said something like "don't do x" and I would say "ok honey, and sulk/seethe at her and myself. Instead she said I don't think you should do x. I said "ok thanks I appreciate your input." And then I did x anyway.
She didn't argue or yell at me like a child, as would have happened in the past. But she brought it up in a sly way, "I wish you hadn't done x." I merely said "well, ok but what do you think we should do now to solve it." The subtle key here was not asking "what should I do." I didn't need or want her to "tell" me what to do. I wanted her opinion before I decided what to do. I do vue her opinion and she is far more politic with others than I am so sometimes I want her opinion. Sometimes.
No conflict, no yelling, no DEERing or apologies and no asking mommy to forgive me or tell me what I should do. I took her input, and then decided what to do. And she accepted it without complaint. As it turned I reversed course on x but it was my call.
If I had to bet, I think I am going to avoid a Main Event. Or I am really wrong and arrogant and will get huge push back while I am called am asshole.
Sex
Thankfully the wife's fat continues to go away. Her clothes are starting to be loose and she (like me) has a sizable gap when she pulls the waist away from her on her pants. She isn't a blue whale anymore; maybe a sperm whale, still big but noticeably smaller. I make a point to compliment her and bring this up often. She always says "I am trying." And I always respond "you aren't trying, you are doing it, and I am proud of you."
So I am going to start initiating a lot more. Already 1 for 1 in successful initiations, though that is a small thing since she probably needs the validation. It isn't exactly a badge of honor to be successful in initiating with a fat wife starved for sexual attention.
Not gonna lie, sex is tough, as she is still unattractive. Too many times in the past I wasn't able to finish or got soft when, during sex, I would see a roll of fat or something else horrible and that would be it. It's like being scarred from an insect bite leading to insect phobias. Plus a lot of small shit tests since the last OYS. I pretty much passed them all, but it's a turnoff for me, and a big one.
So what am I going to do? Seems like a good time to get re-acquainted with TWOTSM. Maybe I can start turning my turnoffs into a more positive view. No more letting shit go or eat at me, I don't have time for anything else but to work at it and improve.
Overall Mission
I have 20 years of marriage, 30 years of blue pill adulthood, and 14 months of Red Pill.
What do I value most? Self-respect. For years I hated myself and what I had become, and was a BP loser for so goddamn long. How do I make this a "mission?" Still looking for a destination.
JCX_Pulse 4y ago
This is too long of a cut. Your body and metabolism adapt, and fast. Try looking into mini cuts and bulks for a more sustainable method of weight loss. While you are short, and small (5'6/148), this calorie amount is what you would expect from a 5'2 woman. With enough muscle mass you won't need to be sub 2k calories just to maintain. IMO, focus on gaining strength. The muscle will help with the fat loss.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Pretty sure that in those 20 years of marriage you created the dynamics that made it OK to be a fat woman. Each pound that comes off now is because you finally started shedding your old habits, leading, and replacing those bad habits with a new ones, Captain. The rope is pulling tight.
I wrote a post about not necessarily changing turnoffs into turnons, but are you happy with the progress? You wrote a lot about it, so I would think so. You're crafting something now. Your woman is one of your greatest creations. From that post:
Might want to think about that mindset if you enjoy the progress.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
Good stuff. I am going to absorb this and think on it
SBIII 4y ago
Do you use the TDEE 3.0 calculator? It takes all the guesswork out of it.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
Yes. But it is still guesswork in that you really don't know if your workouts warrant the 1.15 multiplier or another one.
arm_candy 4y ago
How are you “tapped out” at 13-17% BF? What does that mean?
Bulk if that’s what you want, but I don’t understand how you can’t get to a lower BF. Eat less, exercise more, same as everyone else. If you’re not losing weight, you’re eating at TDEE (or above). Or alternatively you’re just holding a lot of water weight, but that’s doubtful given 9 weeks and only 3.5lb lost.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
I still am so small that I need to cut below acceptable levels. I can't lift and eat 1200 calories a day. And I need to reset the hormones. And I want to bulk; I haven't done a real bulk yet so it's time to give it a try.
arm_candy 4y ago
Acceptable levels are based on your size.
Again, I don’t care if you bulk, but if you’re losing 1/3 lb per week, you’re just not cutting as hard as you think. If you don’t want to cut more calories, add in exercise. 2000 calories burned running/walking/cycling/rowing will have the same effect as cutting another 2000 calories from your weekly diet. Except your cardio health will probably be better.
By the way, be careful with your bulking calories. If you’re not losing at 1300-1500 calories, then you very well might be bulking too fast at 2000-2500. 1300 to 2500 is a big swing.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
Thanks. It is an experiment and I keep tabs on everything, every day so will abort or adjust as I go on.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
Which means what you are doing isn't normal. Which means you're doing it for a reason. That reason is to change your wife. Dance monkey dance.
Withdrawing your time and attention is not something you do to condition your wife. You do it because your time is better spent doing those other things. Its for YOU to claim for YOURSELF what YOU think is a better return on value for YOU.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
Hmmm. Will think about this. So if my goal is to "condition" her what do I do? Or am I thinking about this the wrong way? I am trying to reward good/disincentive bad behavior. If not attention, then what?
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
Your goal is not conditioning her. Wtf? Thats absolutely nice guy behavior. Like exactly nice guy behavior. That's "I'll give you roses if you have sex with me" rewritten. Conditioning is absolutely a covert contract.
Your goal is never her. Its you. So many guys are confusing this that Rule 9 bans are skyrocketing in OYS. She needs to decide to come along not because you've conditioned/forced/nagged/shamed her to. She needs to come along because she wants to. She can only want to if you give her the choice openly and freely. And it's not open or free if it's conditioned.
You're trying to condition her to do what you want because you're afraid of giving her that choice. Because you're afraid she'll say no. Which id like to believe is why the sidebar books are listed in that order: NMMNG first (what I said at the start of this reply), and
WISNIFGWhen Other People Say No, They Don't Have To Feel Guilty.Ubermensch33 4y ago
Yes, "conditioning" is about control. As you said, Nice Guy behavior.
OP, her doing what you desire is a byproduct of who you are - some combination of love+respect+dread she has for you. You doing what she wants is the same. This is healthy. She's not a dog you're giving treats to.
Women are able to see through the charade of conditioning (and everything else) if you're not where you want to be as a man. It's incongruent and inauthentic.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
Got it guys, thanks. As usual I will think about what you have pointed out and keep working. Appreciate the course correction, rewarding good behavior/punishing bad did not mean what I thought. And I probably should have figured that out
MuchAbouAboutNothing 4y ago
OYS #5 (#4, #3, #2, #1)
26yo / 6'1 / 200lbs / LTR
Physical: Big step back. Going hard playing basketball right after heavy squat day fucked up my left knee. First lesson, need to clean up my shitty squat form. When I get back to squatting, going to film myself from a bunch of different angles, self-critique and post on reddit for form checks. No swelling which is a good sign, but knee has been unstable just walking around. Been through something similar a few years ago which healed with a few weeks rest but will look into visiting a physio. Need to step up a couple of other things to do with personal health. Plan is, focus on upper body in the gym, rest until knee feels stable then put together a rehab plan. Knees have been a weak point of mine for a while now so I need to recognise that and make the dull stabilisation and strengthening work a core part of my routine long term.
Work: Going well, taking ownership and trying hard to make a good impression. Early days.
Social: Could do better. Would be great to have more ambitious, high quality friends. Too high a proportion of my social circle is stoners from college. Hard to find ways of making new friends during COVID but even just writing that it's clear that's a bullshit rationalisation. Will make sure I have a plan by next week's OYS.
Relationship: A mess being cleaned up. Much less DEERing, better leadership. Still having to remind myself frequently to be my own mental point of origin. Practice makes perfect. Will focus on reading and applying posts on Frame and Stoicism this week.
Business: Long held goal to start my own business. Have an idea of an internet business, who's product I can design as part of my masters degree. Need to work on the business side of things, will start working on some of the steps in Johney Apocalypse's business post. On a personal level, need to get much better at managing myself if I plan to scale up and manage a business. Need to manage my time and my calendar perfectly. Need to be able to stay on top of minor bullshit like chores. Time to get my shit together.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Sounds like a lot of shit you "need" to do. Yet you're not doing anything.
Gay.
MuchAbouAboutNothing 4y ago
Got it. Will be different next week.
SBIII 4y ago
Fuck off.
RStonePT 4y ago
top kek
Cho_Assmilk 4y ago
Just cause you're a big bad red pill alpha, doesn't mean you need to have like minded friends. Some friends are naturally RP and other never will be. Going about life thinking you're gonna be having wings every Wednesday with a bunch of MRP dudes is a recipe for having no friends. IMO anyway
MuchAbouAboutNothing 4y ago
Good point, hadn't thought of that. Should just widen my circle in general.
stay_plan_is_go_plan 4y ago
OYS #18, OYS #17, OYS #16, OYS #15, OYS #14, OYS #13, OYS #12, OYS #11, OYS #10, OYS #9, OYS #8, OYS #7, OYS #6, OYS #5, OYS #4, OYS #3, OYS #2, OYS #1, OYS #0
Stats: 51 yo, 71kgs, 13.4%BF (Marine method); Squat: 85kgs, OhP: 45kgs, Bp: 65kg, Row: 72.5kg, DL: 95kgs.
Have read: NMMNG, MMSLP, 16 Commandments of Poon, TBOP, 60 Days of Dread, Steele's guide, MAP by Athol Kay, WISNIFG.
Currently reading: Read WISNIFG for the 2rd time.
Mission: “One day at a time ... better today than I was yesterday, stronger tomorrow than I am today”.
General It's been 1 week since I last posted on OYS.
This is a boring update because it's been very quiet over the last week and largely uneventful. After the chaos from work last week, everything seems to have settled down. Work has been progressing (slowly), the GZCL program has been progressing (slowly) and my social life has been progressing (slowly).
I wonder exactly what the hell is going on because it feels a little too good to be true. I ask myself, why do I care? So long as I get to the gym and/or skatepark, I'm having fun.
But am I settling? Am I being lulled back into beta-hood? Or, is that voice in my head my own hamster running riot and making me a giant english-cigarette?
Physical I'm enjoying the GZCL program ... the increased volume at lighter weights have help strengthen some of my smaller muscles. At the end of the 5x5 I had several small injuries. Nothing major, but enough to remind me they were there. GZCL has strengthened those muscle ... I suspect that might be what the first part of the program is all about.
MAP and Relationships I had a good chat with a couple of the guys (Dads) at the skatepark. Interesting guys, and super helpful with some news about the local scene. I haven't seen them since, but will definitely spend more time talking with them the next time I see them.
Relationship with the wife has become fun and very pleasant. I'm not receiving a lot of shit or challenges. We tease each other and have fun. It's light and easy at the moment.
Work Work is slowly improving after the chaos last week. We're making money ... not a lot, but enough to cover the bills and put a little aside.
Goals Here are my 3 goals for the next week:
•
Kino the wife, and start a conversation with 2 randoms during the week.Done.•
Extend chats and interactions to have at least 1 conversation that's more than just "Hi, how are you?"Done.•
Keep optimistic. For me this means not overworking, and spending some time every day doing something that I enjoy.Done.• Start a conversation with 2 randoms during the week.
• Spending some time every day doing something that I enjoy. I got a lot out of this last week, and I want to do it again.
• It's been a while since I revisited my MAP and updated it. I'll do that this week.
UsefulWalk4 4y ago
OYS #31:
Stats: Age 43, Wife 40. Married 15 years, kids 6’2”, 184 lbs. 13% Navy Method. Working on MRP over 3 years, OYS since December.
Lifts: Squat 5x5, 285#, Deadlift 1X5 285#, Row 5X5 185, OHP 5X5 125#, BP 155# X5. I fucking killed it in the gym my last two workouts. Just crushed it, I feel like a beast. Bench Press is slowly progressing. Continue with scapular work. Squats were crushed.
Sex: Zero. Pump hasn’t been primed in nearly a month.
Initiation: Yes 20/21 weeks. I’m working on eliminating masturbating to maximize my desire to initiate. It’s been a week and half, desire to initiate is better.
Sidebar readings: All. Currently paused reading.
Control: I’m working on it. No notable control issues this week. It’s still a red flag area, I take too much on.
Cut: Cut is going well, I started noticing visible changes in just a few days. Fat is just melting away. Sometimes it’s good to be a skinny fuck. Planning at least one more week on cut. Interestingly, my best two workout in a while have been since the cut started. I’m not starving myself, so maybe I have just enough fuel for lifting. I’ll need to update BF%, because it’s much lower than before.
Anger: No issues this weeks. I’ve been a little more relaxed.
Shit Tests/Reactions to Bitchy demands: I pissed her off really bad yesterday. Long story short, I didn’t give a fuck if she was pissed or not. I apologized once for hurting her feelings then I told her I’m not going to beat myself up over it, I hope you don’t either. She dropped it shortly thereafter. In the past it would have taken all night or more for her to drop it. Progress I suppose, but mainly it was me not having any fucks left to give.
Relationship Outlook: Bad. I don’t see a path forward. Anybody who’s read my OYS can easily see that I have had a massive oneitis for my situation if not my wife. I don’t have any hope left. I only see 3 options at this point. 1-Cut bait, 2-cheat, or 3-declare that I’m going to meet my needs elsewhere. I’m leaning toward #3, what’s the worst that could happen (#1 is what I see). Eval with attorney is setup as I work on the go plan.
Mission: Been busy which is good. Most of my activity has been on point and has left me out of the house a lot. I’m doing what I want to do, which is good. It’s not creating much if any dread, which isn’t ideal. I recently read a critique of the 12 levels of dread as a covert contract. I agree in premise. I wouldn’t mind slapping her upside the head with a little dread. I feel like the wife is about to get hit by a truck and she doesn’t see it coming. I need to find someway of giving her warning. It’s only fair in my opinion. That went way off track on “Mission”, but I’m leaving it.
One aspect of Mission that needs improved is getting out there and having “fun”, I’m enjoying what I’m up to, but I basically never do anything because I think it will be “fun” for me. Everything has a deeper purpose, which is fine sometimes, but other times I need to go grab a beer with a friend for no reason or something. Large red flag in this portion.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Barf. It's clear to me and everyone here that you couldn't actually get your needs met elsewhere right now. How do I know?
Bro, your ego is transparent here. She can read through the bullshit too, which is why all this dancing monkey bullshit isn't working.
I think it's time you get back to reading. No idea why you're not.
Grab a copy of Day Bang. Read it. Go play some catch and release. Your abundance mentality is severely lacking, but your nice guy mental models are telling you that deserve sex.
You ain't shit.
You say you're initiating, but are you? Hard? What the fuck is happening that you're seeing when you do? Are you getting LMR? Hard no's?
Quit going Captain Rambo McFucktard.
UsefulWalk4 4y ago
Johney and 3kindsofLucky suggested I clear my head up about 3 weeks ago. Basic recommendation was my head was (is?) filled with all kinds of craziness and I'm tripping over my own BS. I have felt more clear headed since I paused.
I think I could. Maybe I'm lying to myself. My problem is I dug myself a big ass hole with a bunch of Blue Pill oneitis behaviors over the course of years. I never had any similar troubles until I committed to one woman and unwisely handed over my balls. My unwillingness to walk away from bad behaviors and disrespect is what got me here. I'm typically willing to walk from anything if it doesn't meet my needs. My marriage has been a massive exception.
I do feel like I'm a man who deserves sex. You deserve what you get in life. I intend to get to a better place soon.
Hard to argue that, I'm a British Cig looking for sex advice on a Reddit site. Not in a position to brag at the moment.
Initiations have been shitty in the past, I ramped it up massively this week. I get Hard No's. typically with IOU for "later" which as we all know is worthless. I've come to realize that what you told me a while back is true. She's just not attracted to me. So, why the fuck am I putting up with that?
I respect your opinions and advice. I'll consider whether I'm going of the deep end prematurely. First thought is it took me forever to get to this point. I'm not coming unglued over a moment, I'm thinking the same thing for weeks.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
It's not unusual for sex to lull and be weaponized around this time from what I've seen.
Are you still giving her affection even though you're not getting laid? Are you playing push/pull well? Or are you all push?
UsefulWalk4 4y ago
I'm leaning toward the simpler explanation that she's just not attracted to me, but maybe that's Rambo talking. My old thought process was that she must have a low libido, she's saying all the right things. I no longer subscribe to that explanation.
Had to look up push/pull to develop an understanding.
All push. Spent over a decade in pull mode. I naturally gravitate to pull, so it's probably not 100% push (just feels like it to me). Probably need to work on this aspect.
Minimal affection. Not zero, but certainly not the full reward either.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
I can't believe I'm about to give this advice... but you need to work up the dread levels.
Just please for the love of God be aware of the covert contract.
I say this because your lifts, weights and BF% (if true) and yoir amount of time doing this, along with your admittance to instilling zero dread mean that something isn't clicking in the relationship and you need to make it her responsibility.
Hopefully you understand I rarely give this recommendation because I think that roadmap is fucked... and you can read between the lines.
UsefulWalk4 4y ago
I think this advice is on point for my situation. When I first arrived, years ago, before I started posting my OYS I dove head first into 12 L of Dread. Sweet a road map! Just what I was looking for. Didn't work. Why? Gigantic Covert contract. Doing it for her and her alone. I recently read the post saying the same thing, I learned the hard way.
I think as I move my finger over the Nuke button progressing thru the levels of dread again might be a good way to wake her up to her situation. Thru covert conversation. I'd rather avoid the "overt" discussion if possible, but realistically I'll take that step before (or maybe as) I push the button finally.
She's asleep, I spent over a decade establishing how important family was and making her so secure that she thinks I'd never go. Perhaps running thru the dread levels will provide some stimulus for her. Might be fun for me anyway. It's on me to give her proper notice to wake up before I hit "next".
I've always been willing to hit "next" on everything in life (outside of this situation). It's a trait that serves me well. Most people in business or friendship think twice about fucking with someone who's always willing to cut bait and move on. They respect you and treat you as such. My BP, Disney delusions caused my wife to loose that fear and respect. In the end you get what you deserve.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
Im with /u/HornsOfApathy. I dont think you could.
And this is why. A guy who could would be EAGER to. Because he knows he's such a catch that he's simply giving his wife first crack. He would almost be wishing she wouldn't rise to meet him because them he could dive into a newfound world of fun, discovery, playfulness with others that he's been denied so long.
But it seems you are melancholy about your whole situation. This is not the mark of a prize with frame.
And maybe thats where you err. Cuz sure...youll go out and get something. But will it be what you want? Do you even know how to search for and elicit that?
UsefulWalk4 4y ago
What I really want is for that 1000' rope to tighten up and my wife and family to come along. This is what's holding me back. I've been waiting and hoping for that one outcome. I'm beginning to come to terms with the possibility that option just doesn't exist for me. I'm trying (with maximum effort) to internalize that the stay plan is the go plan. As a family man with family values, I'm struggling. It's a limiting belief that's holding me back.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
And she knows it.
Why you must be willing to nuke your nuclear family.
This post was 100% written for you.
UsefulWalk4 4y ago
I read it when you wrote it and just re-read it. 100% on point. That's what's been holding me back. From the post:
That's where I'm at. I'm turning up the pressure and working my way out. I hope she stops me on the way, but if she doesn't I'm out.
Exactly this. She hasn't budged because she's sure I'm a "Good Caveman".
Echoes the themes of OYS posts. I once posted about being trapped in a prison of my own design. I've been keenly aware that my commitment to my family has been the piece holding everything back. I'm really just coming to a point where I'm stealing my nerves before I push the button.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
When the stay plan is the go plan, there is no button. Every guy on here that is successful according to their vision is employing the go plan. There is no stay plan. It's just that our wives keep "go-ing" with us. We keep daring them to fail. And they don't.
UsefulWalk4 4y ago
I keep daring her to succeed. And she doesn't.
I suppose the question is how long do I allow that to go.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
Reverse psychology...funny how it works.
1001290 4y ago
OYS1
6’4” 250lbs, 33, married, 3 kids. Fat.
GYM: 3x a week, started 9/17. SQ 145, BP 135, DL 185, OHP 85 all 4x6/lbs some accessories work after mains.
Read: NMMNG, WISNIFG, Subtle art of not giving a fuck, day bang, MMSLP, MAP
Reading: NMMNG again.
Background: I never thought in terms of beta/alpha until having visited MRP. One year ago at work, I had this strange epiphany that I complained too much. I began watching what I was saying and realized it was a problem. A reddit search about complaining too much introduced me to your community. I learned a lot from the reading:
I also learned some ways out of this. Set one maybe two goals and nail em. My two simple goals I want to reach are
I plan to continue STFU and reading, not as a goal but way of living.
ON THE HOME FRONT:
The relationship between my wife and I has stagnated. It’s dull where there used to be fun. I don’t think I’ve fully accepted that it’s ALL my fault. I want to. But then I go playing the blame game. I used to come home after work, drink beer, hang out with the kids and play video games. I no longer come home, drink beer, and play video games. I want more sex but also have insecurities about how long I last. I want the sessions to last, but they don’t. I’m curious if losing weight and getting stronger will help me in this area.
I am not an OAK, and I am very emotionally turbulent. I want to fix this. When I “must”, I can be an OAK, but...for some reason I can’t continue being it all the time. STFUing and simply observing might benefit me in this area. Because of the emotional turbulence, I talk to fucking much. I want to win in this area. I really want to win in STFU and to look at life amused. Easier said than done, but where I used to get pissed off, I want to begin genuinely laughing at it.
WORK:
Started a new position 4 months ago and I’m killing it. I’m hitting the benchmarks set for me and also managing the staff well. I’m aiming for promotion by MAY2021. I do not like the 50 hour work week, but for the first time in my life there is potential for a great career in this field. I have to utilize a lot of tactics from WISNIFG while engaging employees who aren’t performing their assigned duties. I want my work frame to become somewhat of my at-home frame.
I still have desires to create multiple streams of income. 5 years ago, I stopped trying. I’m currently saving some money to begin this pursuit again.
EXTRAS:
I love writing and playing music, all different genres. I faced a very big fear 1 week ago, and led worship alone at my church with one back-up vocal. It went so well that a congregant asked me to reach out to him if I ever wanted to record some of my songs. Why am I writing this? I want to find those areas of my life where I’m afraid and go live on that edge.
This week we are camping. I’ll be surrounded by 5 ladies and 1 male. They are all family and some had a very hard year. I want to enjoy their company and vice versa.
GOAL
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Good goals - keeping it simple and focused. Focus on not being fat for the next 40 days. Nothing else matters. You're fat and unattractive. Until that changes nothing else will.
Dynabruh 4y ago
Oys 1
28 y/o wife 28 2 kids 1 & 7 148lbs as of right now Don’t know my body fat % guessing around 15 Bp 145x6 ohp 80x6 squat 135x6 dL 225x6
This is my first oys. I got here the way most men do. Low sex marriage. Run of the mill beta. Bent over backwards tried as hard as I could and got shit on. And hurt for not getting what I thought I deserved. It’s still a struggle but Mrp has helped beyond belief. I started to post oys twice but I wasn’t ready then. I’ve been lurking for a while on a different account but deleted it while reading nmmng and mmslp I was going Rambo and it wasn’t working for me so I had to take a little break
Physical Currently cutting. I know I’ve not got much mass to cut but I’m tired of being skinny fat and I’ve been keeping an eye on what muscle I have gained in the past few months. I started going to the gym sometime in June. I’ve been doing a legs push pull push legs split instead of a 3 day a week 5x5. I get more volume and it’s more time efficient. Doing about 80% compound lifts. I only do my pull muscles once a week for now since my back is more developed than the rest of my muscles. I do however do my deadlifts on leg days so I get some back and trap stimulation there as well. All in all very happy with how it’s working so far. I do keep an eye on it in case I need to tweek
Social I worked a 12 Saturday but despite that I took off Friday and went to a local car event in a touristy area about an hour away. Spent all day Friday ride around on the golf cart with my wife’s sisters in-laws. Saturday night we went back down and her sister and her husband rode around the strip with us. There was girls flashing for beads on the strip. There’s three lanes so I got in the center lane and we were all throwing beads. My wife even earned a few of her own. I had a lot of success though and I think it put a little dread in my wife being in the back seat while all those girls were flashing their tits to me. I’ve got to work this weekend as well but I’m trying to plan something with a couple friends. I know it was just a short trip with family members but it’s such a big deal for me because before anytime we would do anything with her family or friends she would shit test be terrible in front of them. So I’m happy about that as well
Relationship It’s came a long way but it’s still very up and down. I still deer a lot. I don’t know how to pass a lot of test and she calls me out when I stfu. Probably being autistic as hell. The weekend was great and so was yesterday but I’m afraid when the fun and dread from the weekend ware off and we go back to the day to day it’ll be rough again. I try to keno and be fun through the week but sometimes it’s hard with so much to do and two little cockblockers around all the time
Financial It’s tight. Like leggings a size too small tight. She’s a stay at home mom currently. I’m going to put in for a job that’s hiring near me that would be a 10$ raise if I can pass the weld test. And she got a job and starts training the 29th
Goals I want to keep cutting til I can see all of my abs (that are there) Get better at passing shit test Be less boring through the week Get the job I’m putting in for
AlphalfaSprout 4y ago
How tall are you? Cutting at your weight is an interesting decision.
Kids aren’t cockblockers. Make playing with you the highlight of your kids’ day. These are your kids. Based on where you are at, passive dread is probably your best bet at a dancing monkey goal right now. Kids are a great source of that. Get home in the evening, take the little fuckers to the park and leave your wife at home to wonder about how much fun you are having without her.
red-sfpplus 4y ago
Hey new fish.
You wife should loose some weight. At 148# she is a little big.
Post up your stats so we can give you a gauge on yourself.
/s
Dynabruh 4y ago
148 is me lol I’m 5’6 sorry I rushed to do my oys on my lunch break
Vegasman20002 4y ago
This hurts. 40 pounds from now my wife will be 148.
arm_candy 4y ago
Last week I was called out by /u/johneyapocalypse for basically engaging in a self-inflicted pity party. I dumped a big list of stuff I’ve been fucking up, with the intention of being honest about the work I need to do. Maybe I did that, but I also excluded almost anything positive. At the end of the day, the “I’m so honest about my shortcomings bit” is still feeding my ego, isn’t entirely honest, and isn’t solving any actual problems.
I was asked to provide five examples of self control, along with one thing I’m proud of. I don’t know whether these are supposed to only be within the last week or not, but here we go:
And here is something I’m proud of:
I like my wife and my marriage. I’ve gone from feeling trapped and desperately unhappy in my marriage a couple of years ago to being content. It’s not where I’d like it to ultimately be but it’s so much better. I’m not constantly stressed about her reactions and emotions. I’m not trying to get in her head and analyze stuff she does. I feel like our interactions are better and more authentic. Sex is of course also better than it used to be. This difference is probably 95% mental. But yeah, I’m also more physically attractive.
Here’s some stuff I did this week:
And here’s some stuff I need to work on:
Stats: 5’7”, late 30s, 149lb. OHP 115, BP 170 (est), DL 310 (est)
SBIII 4y ago
Try hitting five. Your (est) lifts are lousy.
arm_candy 4y ago
True enough. My lifts do suck.
petey208 4y ago
OYS#4
Stats:
Age: 43; Married 8yrs, Together 10yrs, Wife 39, two kids 4 and 6
Reading: NMMNG, WISNIFG, Rational male, MMSLP, TWOTSM, Book of Pook, Currently reading Practical Female Psychology; The Subtle Art of Not Giving a Fuck; Currently reading The Daily Stoic and Rian Stone YT MMSLP refresher.
Fitness: 198lbs, 5 11", BF 17% (caliper) BP 275, DL 406, squat 275, OP 205. I lift 5 -6 days per week, Intermittent fast M-F and fuck it up on the weekends. Feeling Strong. Been experimenting with the extended fast. Finished a 72hr fast. My longest fast thus far. Felt good, was in ketosis and my energy levels were decent, lifts were strong. I felt a little more winded between lifts but overall I enjoyed the experience. It was a good reset. Goal was forced Ketosis, to jumpstart a thereputic Ketogenic cut over the next few weeks. My goal is 12lbs. In additions to my lifts I have added 3 Peleton sessions this week and last week for additional cardio.
Background: Classic Betabux story. Good looking, seemingly successful, Nice guy with fucked up mental models that were established at a young age with my single mom who taught me how to pedestalized women. I am fucking great at it! Done it all my life and have I let my current LTR walk all over me as a result. Was given a “We don’t have a connections speech in 2017 along with an emotional affair. Instead of burning it to the ground and demoting her, I begged for her to stay. Still married and lost I found the Rational Male by chance and then this reddit. I have been LARPing here since summer 2019.
Work: work is great, I trade lumber with one of the companies I am salaried for and we have been trading at all-time high. We produce the lumber with a very low basis. I also sell industrials for another company I profit share with and we are on the heels of some great projects that will fill my order file through the end of the year. Goal for this area is to continue to grow my relationships, my product knowledge on the manufacturing side of our operations, and grow our industrial division. Continue to lead as a top salesman.
Current: Calm waters on the home front. With No major shittests to report. The wife has been seeking comfort which I have given. Family time has been of good quality, with farmers markets, meals out, ice cream runs for chores completed, bike rides, and a daily dose of wrestling. I feel like a good captain to my kids. I have great frame with them and boundaries are clarified, enforced and are consistent. I can see my wife following suit with better boundary enforcement herself and as the kids push her boundaries she using me as the “bad cop”. I fully embrace the role. I feel is shows my kids who the captain is and who is holding frame. Booked a brunch date with my wife. I booked the sitter, let the wife know to be ready when the sitter arrived. The date was met with enthusiasm and at a get together prior I was told other wives in the neighborhood to “to teach my husband” or “rub off on my husband” (phrasing I know….). Be Attractive, don’t be unattractive. Girls talk.. they talk about the bad and the good. It should be noted I booked the date because I wanted to spend time with my wife. Period. In the past it would have been part of a covert contract.
Mental: My mental is good. Outcome independence and a stoic mindset to my reaction have been very helpful. This has transferred directly to my frame. I am not just reacting with the first emotion that comes into my mind. I am being a better listener as a result.
Something that bothers me is my wife’s dishonesty. Just little “white lies” that she may tell. I catch her every once in a while on inconsequential things. But it bothers me. It bothers me because I don’t understand why? i.e. my daughter came out wearing a pair of my wife’s new shoes. I noticed and said “Those are nice, when did you get those?” “I bought those last December.” My daughter (6 yrs old) called her out and said “no mom, you bought those when we went school shopping” (30 days ago). Women know when they buy new stuff. My reaction was not in anger, I grabbed my wife and with a smirk said “ you know exactly when you bought those don’t lie”, as she pulled away, I pulled her back and said again “don’t lie, especially when there is no reason to”. I then STFU pulled my attention for the rest of the evening. Internally, it really bothered me and reinforced my trust but verify attitude with this woman. Why lie? I didn’t understand the motive. I don’t care if she buys hot shoes, I want her to look good? I shrugged it off, as most women lie, they lie to each other daily. I think it bothered me, because my daughter witnessed it and honesty is a core valued I instill in my kids
Social: Had 4 couples over for dinner and a nightcap this last Friday. Played the mayor and had a good time. Good conversation. Booked a boys trip for the first week in October. Meeting my best friend from childhood. We were wingmen to each other in our single days and he is single and plating now. I am anticipating comfort tests from the prior to my departure.
Sex: Last week was shark week and HJ and BJ offered and taken. Wife said she bought something from Victoria Secret for me this week.
MAP: Continue to lift 6x per week and experiment with fasting and Keto with an emphasis on strength and muscle preservation. STFU. Be attractive, don’t be unattractive. Game wife daily, escalate when I want with OI. Praise good behavior, do not reward bad behavior, be social, be the mayor. STFU. STFU. STFU. "If you build it they will come".
Mission: Be the Captain. Enjoy life and be in the moment. Continue to grow always. Be healthy, read, learn. There are no mistakes, just lessons.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
That's a lot of reading done for OYS 4. My opinion is that most guys go too broadly at the start, rather than absorbing and focusing on the right stuff. Better to read and think about NMMNG at your stage than to read TWOTSM for example. Spend time thinking and putting stuff into practice instead of moving on to the next book in the sidebar.
petey208 4y ago
Thanks for the input. I need to clarify, my current reading is the Daily Stoic and MMSLP with RS YT Summary. I have read NMMNG x2; Rational Male x2; WISNIFG x2 since summer of 2019. My focus has been on the the RP 101 fundamentals that will help ME with frame, my own mental point of origin, and outcome independence. I will be the first to own that my first readings were an exercise. It was the 2nd readings, the OYS comments, and book summaries from Rian Stone as well as his cooking series on YT where I have found the most value and reinforcement thus far. Looking forward to the WhineMorePlease channel as well. Listened to last weeks OYS and enjoyed the expansion on the comments.
JCX_Pulse 4y ago
If this is a boundary you have, enforce it.
You're incongruent here. Either it bothers you, or it doesn't. You didn't address the lying as a problem, but acted angrily.
I see lying as blatant disrespect UNLESS it's been conditioned, say, if you previously lied or would get butt hurt if she told you the truth.
You said you don't reward bad behavior, but your actions spoke differently in this situation. You need to sort this out.
She had an emotional affair. To me, any lying after having an emotional (and likely physical) affair would be a deal breaker. She's proven to be untrustworthy once, and now she's slipping back into those habits. Even the way you describe her "pulling away" from you is suspect. Does she believe you'll walk? I don't believe you'll walk. You know you won't walk. I think you still pedestalize her and even rationalize why she lied for her.
You've got the itis, and you've got it bad, and for a woman who's grown accustomed to disrespecting you.
petey208 4y ago
Honesty is boundary I expect not to be crossed given our history.
I can see the incongruence and felt it at the time. We were all being Jovial up to that point in the evening and I didn't want to blow it up with loss of frame or temper. So I withdrew my affection and attention the rest of the evening. I didn't feel like it was in a butthurt fashion. She saw my disappointment in her little white lie. Maybe after the kids were in bed I could have called her to the floor and reiterated my disappointment and my boundary. But this woman knows I don't trust her. Why should I?
Good Question. Does she believe I would walk over this or something similar? No. Its been conditioned. If she engaged in the texting or messaging of another dude? Yes. She knows I would walk. I would. Without a second thought.
I'm humble enough to understand that I am just finding my balls here and only one of them has dropped. I have gone Rambo to a point where I was accused of having an affair. Too much too soon. The past month and 1/2 I have pulled my shit together and have been focusing on Frame and getting my dick wet in the process of my journey of growth. My point is why consider walking when I have sparring partner, that has seen my worst, cheated on me (emotionally and even maybe physically), and can shit test me better than any new model could? Talk about a challenge. I would love to revisit these questions once my other ball has dropped. Until then. Practice sparring with a woman I'm not even sure I like.
Recovering Itis. Wife goggles have been slapped right off my face thanks to falling dick first into the rational male and this space. Thanks for challenging me. The added perspective is gold. After I find my other ball, I hope to find the imaginary finish line.
Ubermensch33 4y ago
I see it differently. If she's lying like that, it's likely because she doesn't respect you as much as you'd like (and perhaps other reasons, like if you've gotten really mad at her for making purchases in the past, etc...).
The problem is there's nothing you can do in that moment to fix a lack of respect. There are better and worse ways of handling it, but if she has a lack of respect for you, most everything you do as a reaction is going to come off as butthurt. I don't really believe in intentionally withdrawing in situations like these because of this reason.
'Why lie about it...especially when there's no reason to?" is a classic difference in the masculine and feminine. As a man it doesn't make sense to you. She could have any number of reasons for lying to you in that moment, ranging from "in that moment I just wanted to feel something" to "I'm fucking all of our couples friends' husbands and I lie to you all the time, petey08."
A while back my girl lied to me about a big ding in my surfboard, which stays upright in our garage. The dog was playing with her giant ball (german shepherd), and hit the ball into the board, which then fell onto my squat rack, putting a hole in the side of it. When I asked her if she knew anything about it, I immediately knew she was lying to me. I asked her again. And a 3rd time. Then said "huh...ok." and went about my business. A few hours later she came to me on her own and confessed, citing that she thought I'd get angry at the dog, which was a mostly bullshit reason. It was an accident. It happens. I told her I appreciated her telling me, kissed her, told her not to worry about taking to get it fixed, it's no problem, I'll take care of it. Don't worry, the water was cold as shit, I wasn't going surfing that weekend anyway. I gave her an out.
My point is that having to explicitly enforce a boundary like that is an adversarial position. You want to be on the same team. But until you've created that dynamic, you don't really have much leverage to enforce little shit like that (the irony is that when you do have the leverage and respect, you don't need to explicitly enforce boundaries much). The explicit boundary enforcement stuff is a useful mental model for guys that have been doormats their entire lives/relationships.
JCX_Pulse 4y ago
I like your assessment here and agree with everything you said. I think you did a much better job of what I was trying to say.
petey208 4y ago
Could be lack of respect to someone that has allowed you to treat them like a doormat and has only been establishing boundaries for about a year. Or it was an oh shit, I bought myself shoes when I went "school clothes shopping " with my daughter and I don't want to own it so I'll tell him i bought them last winter. My daughter called her out, otherwise I would have taken her answer as it was.
I definitely don't have the leverage to enforce yet. Adversarial position most definitely right now. Easy to get caught up in rushing the dynamic that you are talking about. I appreciate the the feedback.
Ubermensch33 4y ago
Yeah, and maybe it's not worth reading into all that much or making such a big deal. Not everything is some super deep mystery that needs to be philosophized over and over. That mode of thinking keeps us stuck and makes it really difficult to not give a shit, when the appropriate reaction may have simply been to just glare and smirk at her when you found out she was lying. Instead you've expended lots of mental energy on it. She likely doesn't give a shit.
This is why you'll see guys around here quote Rollo and say it's so much more productive to spend that energy on someone new (paraphrased). Of course, married with young kids makes it tougher to just walk, and you're the only one that can weigh out all the factors.
But it sounds like you got the "I love you but I'm not in love with you" speech. Has /u/hornsofapathy reached out yet?
Edit: just read your post history, looks like you're well acquainted with ILYBINILWY. BTW, your tone in your OYS re: your relationship this week is completely different than 4 weeks ago. Is it improving or have you just gotten better at massaging the words used to talk about it? I'm going to call a little bit of bullshit...
petey208 4y ago
I had similar thoughts before I put it to paper.
I met a version of ILYBINILY in late 2017 with an EA. Early this year over a glass of wine and deep conversation, I was told the She didn't want it to define her love for me and was internalized by her as a dark period in her life where "we were shit" and her decisions were out of her true character. She was ashamed, etc, etc. I took it with a grain of salt as I truly am her best option.
I don't expect you to know me by 4000 words and my shitty story telling. I can tell you that the past 4 weeks have been better. No Rambo, NO fighting in front of our kids, Great Family time, date nights, sex, and BJs and HJ during shark week. I can assure you, I'm here for the right reasons. My time is valuable and I don't want or need Validation from the internet. My tone IS better, as I have held better frame and have seen results. I appreciate your time, and based on your comments you seem to have spent some time in this space and know your shit. I haven't read an OYS but I assume you know how to apply it as well. Ill give you the benefit of the doubt. I gain nothing from bullshitting this space. I know that.
Ubermensch33 4y ago
The reason I brought it up is because you seem to have a lot of your shit together in this OYS - physically, mentally, work, etc...but it read differently in your past OYS.
I'm just a dude on the internet. Take what makes sense to you and leave the rest.
Step_Aside_Butch 4y ago
13th OYS
Stats: 42, Married 11 years, together 16. 2 kids under 10.
Read: NMMNG, WISNIFG, MMSLP, Rational Male, Subtle Art, Unfuck Yourself, SGM, Models. Physical: 5’9”, 160 lbs. Waist 31”, neck 14”. Body fat est. 13%-15%.
I watched the youtube chat this weekend. First, thanks to WNS and HOA for taking the time to read My Shit. It was funny to hear myself described as skinny. I opened the year at 175 and have been 175-185 most of my adult life. So of all the things I’ve been called in my day, “skinny” is a new one.
Lifts: Bigger Leaner Stronger PPL 6 Days / week. Deadlift: 255x5, Squat 235x5, Bench 155x5.
The commentary around whether 6 days a week is too much is something I’ve been thinking about myself. BLS advocates this only if eating at a surplus, which I’m not - my weight is unchanged in 2 months so I’m right around maintenance. My lifts aren’t moving up either, so something is clearly off with my programming, nutrition, or both.
The program changes I mentioned last week reduce DL to once a week and squatting every 5 days to provide more rest. Other days other than chest involve additional work on shoulders and upper back, which are weak areas that have contributed to past shoulder impingement and poor posture that I’m working to improve.
Where this leaves me: I’m happy with how I look and feel right now, though there is always room for improvement. My intention through the fall and winter is to get a little bit leaner, a little bit bigger, and develop my strength over time on the core lifts, which are still mediocre. I like being lean and am not interested in running bulk and cut cycles, so will continue to eat clean at or slightly above maintenance, and focus on hitting my protein targets. I will evaluate my progress and make adjustments as necessary.
Nutrition: Targeting 2300-2400 cal / day, ratio of 30/40/30 protein/carb/fat, with 1.1 g per lb of bodyweight for protein. As mentioned, this is proving to be about maintenance for me right now.
Social: Quiet week. Met up with a buddy for a spur of the moment lunch midweek. WFH and kids now in school give me more flexibility for stuff like this. I’m going to keep up meetups like this, but avoid lunches out to keep nutrition on track. I have some like minded friends who are happy to catch up over a walk, rather than a beer. Other outlets have been return to school and coaching kids sports - both provided the opportunity to catch up with people I haven’t seen for a while.
Relationship: This is generally good, with no significant highs or lows to report. Sex is mostly dependent on my initiations, which is fine, and works out to 1-2 times a week. I still get caught up in my own head at times, thinking about whether I should “bother” to initiate. It’s my attempt to read the situation and preempt a denial. I need to work on this and ensure all initiations are in my frame.
Mental: Following the “1% better each day” rule:
Get enough sleep to support lifting: Achieved lights out between 10 and 10:30 each night; I am averaging 7 hours with a 5-530 wake up.
Alcohol: 6/7 days completely dry; exception was a G&T on Sunday evening.
Making good use of my mornings: Did well here, am well into an interesting non-RP book which I’ll finish in the next couple of days, and have another ready to go. Was up and moving between 630 and 7 each day for exercise. Meditation did not happen - this is something I want to try out. I found a free resource and will try some sessions this week to see if I like it.
Add this week: Guitar. I’m self taught and was once pretty proficient around a campfire, but haven’t really touched it the past 10 years. Fall/winter goal is to get this skill back. I found free online lessons and am starting from scratch, in case there are any basic tips I missed when first learning. Goal is 15 minutes practice per day - I managed to do this 3 nights last week and am 2 for 2 so far this week.
RStonePT 4y ago
So you're eating at maintenance and wondering why you're not getting bigger or stronger? I don't understand.
SBIII 4y ago
Maybe if you followed the advice of the book - it's laid there out for a reason.
sidepiecebandit 4y ago
OYS #34
33, 5’7, 14% BF
When I first started with these posts, one of the flaired members asked why I was here. I'm not married, no children, hit the gym regular, and spin plates. What value did I gain from posting here. Or give, rather. For a while I couldn't express it, all I knew was that there was something of value for me in this space. It was slow, I posted every month just to gauge my progress but it was fleeting. I knew it was important, but was unsure what I was trying to accomplish. I was chopping wood, carrying water. Mostly to accomplish my goals, and maybe a little frame. It was superficial. But as of late, I've become more engaged. Mostly because I can vocalize and pin-point the main purpose of me being here. To kill the nice guy and eradicate validation-seeking behaviours. This week has shown why it is so essential for me to do so.
I had to deal with a family emergency with my 24 year old brother who's been spiralling out of control for the last few years. Had to go over to his gf’s disgusting apartment to rip his drunk ass out of bed because they’d gotten physical and she was about to call the cops. Substance abuse, lack of ownership, finding co-dependent girls he can mooch off of because he can't support himself. Nothing new. He has a record, can't get a job, and is all around learned helplessness to a T.
Prior to MRP I would have relinquished my responsibilities as the oldest brother. Out of sight. Out of mind. And MRP teaches that you can't lead anyone towards unfucking themselves. But now, when it pertains to family, I’m having gripes with this philosophy. Do you just let a loved one self-destruct? I understand yes, if it's at the expense of your own well-being. But if you have the resources, the time, abundance, why not?
My father is also around, and he's old school in that to him parental responsibilities were relegated to paying the bills. Every other need that a child may have is superfluous and is a sign of being spoiled. A luxury he didn’t have as a child. He holds grudges, withholds attention and he'd be willing to watch you fail and destroy yourself as long as he gets to say I told you so. He relishes in it. But surprisingly, as I brought the whole family together to address my brother's deterioration into substance abuse and despondency, he was engaged. My brother in question even acknowledged that my presence has altered our father's mood for the better. I got a certain feeling from that. But it's clear that I'm still aching for validation from my family. From my half-brothers. Still something I need to deal with.
What the week also revealed was how my step mother, his mother, truly fucked us over. It was part of my 1st post, and I was quickly reprimanded for the victim puke. But over the course of the weekend, each one of my 3 generally reserved half-siblings started crying at one point or another, directly as a result of their mother (my step mother) and how the manic episodes, the depression, physical and emotional abuse has affected them.
This experience showed how far I've come. But revealed how much more I have to go. What I came here for deep down was to kill the nice guy so that I could become a better leader. To move my mission forward. And to help guide my siblings as they discover their owns paths. But I must be careful with that last statement, as it's still a covert contract I harbour.
The good news is, I dealt with the issue and things are looking better. I’ve seen indications that he's starting to own his shit. And he's responsive to getting help. We're going to work on his finances and deal with his record so that he can at least find employment. He's decided to see a psychiatrist regarding his mood swings and general symptoms of mental health issues: for years we've suspected he's bipolar. But it's still early, so I can't be too pollyannaish about his progress. I'm quite sure he’s going to fuck it up. But it's not for me to own.
And yet, here I am. A whole post about my brother. Despite owning my shit, hitting the gym, taking on a new project at work leading about 13 people, eating clean, finally being back to sub 15% body fat, dealing with this incident effectively, this whole episode has rocked parts of my internal frame. I could barely sleep that night. The same image of finding him drunk out of his mind sleeping naked in his gf's crack-den of an apartment covered in scratches and blood replayed in my mind. I don't want that for anyone I care about, and I'll do whatever I can to prevent it.
sodarishnod 4y ago
OYS #22 (9/21) Stats: 50, wife 49, 4 kids - 21, 19, 12, 11. Over a year in. Moment of Illumination: 8/3/20 - “I didn’t ask you because I knew you’d say no.”
First 10 videos of Blue Pill Professor’s video series. Reading WISNIFG, Seven Levels of Intimacy, Mastery and Pook. Read WSM, PFS, Poon, MAP, NMMNG (3x), RM, MMSL (2x), WISNIFG (3x), SGM.
5'11", 180 lbs, BF 20% (Navy Method). BP 200, Squat 145 x 10, OHP 100 x 10, DL 130 x 10, Row 85 x 12
PHYSICAL: Switched from cutting to bulking (first time) as I got close to 10% weight loss and I wanted to see the difference of non-keto diet with lifts. I’m following 40/40/20 on protein/carbs/fats. Moved reps on some lifts from 12 to 10 as my back seems fully recovered. Need to work on yoga and core work. A recent post I made on AskMRP really challenged me with how much more is possible for my lifts. I think I was giving myself a false limit or expectation based on my age.
WORK: Two new clients have started, and two more are moving forward to signed contracts. There’s personal mental tapes that I can now hear that are about self-confidence that I have been attacking as they come up - can I handle the workload, can I actually address areas I failed in before? I’ve been replying with “I can handle this,” and opening up to ways of working and commitments I haven’t considered before. Success seems to likely look like something I haven’t done or been before.
RELATIONSHIP: No significant change. I reviewed my MAP. There’s not an elevator summary of them, so I made one to keep the 30,000 foot view in front of me:
Phase 1 - Work on Reds. Typically short. Don’t fight over the requests. Don’t waste the energy. Do them, then do my stuff. Phase 2 - Work on Yellows. 1 mo to 1 year. Simply ask for what I want. If “no”, say thanks and move on. If it’s sex, start the process earlier in the day. Say no to unreasonable or mean requests. Most powerful and dominant thing I can do. Say yes to the behaviors I want to see. Phase 3 - Work on Greens. Request she treat me better. Upgrade wardrobe - best affordable and appropriate for location, a little better than my peer group. Phase 4 - Typically a moment. Summarize demand in one to two sentences. Demonstrate you have options. Phase 5 - Withdraw support. Prepare to exit. Phase 6 - The big event
My Reds are addressed (No Broken Things, Don't Be Lazy, Don't Ignore Others) and I’m moving into Yellows. Shit Tests and Frame are two of my Yellows, and hence my review of BPP’s video series.
I now see that my friends and journaling have been a necessary piece. They are a place to process my feelings instead of puking on my wife, and enable me, at times, to even be positive and unaffected by her “loading the dishwasher wrong” type comments. When I’m not talking with friends, journaling or engaging on MRP or AskMRP, I become more erratic.
MENTAL: Meditation app most days last week and it’s been good - slows down my chaotic, reactionary and escapist thinking, more present, more self-aware and aware of what’s going on around me. Sometimes I start thinking of the comments here that my wife is having an affair or someone in mind and I lose my shit and start snooping. My mental state afterwards is crap and nothing productive. Whether she is or will, seems like should have no impact on me. I should keep working on myself and be stoic.
SPIRITUAL: Guitar and bible journal still going well. Working on sharing insights with the kids.
throw-away1715 4y ago
OYS #1
STATS - Age 27 Wife 25 Married 1 year, together for 7. 6ft 2"
LIFTS - DL 60Kg BP 60Kg Squat 60Kg
READING - The rational male , NMMNG MMSLP, MAP, Pook Sidebar.
INTRODUCTION - I posted here under a different name at the beginning of the year, my wife found my posts and I deleted the account. I was weak, lacked frame, and tried to go back to my blue pill roots, but as I'm sure you all know, once you learn the truth you can't turn your back on it, this comunity is the way forward, it's the only true way to unfuck oneself.
In the time since, I have lurked, and continued my reading, and piece by piece things have fallen into place. This is me starting the process as it should have been in the beginning.
RELATIONSHIP - At the start of the year I was a complete mess of a person, I was completely reliant on external validation for my own happiness and self worth. Sex was a means to prove I had value. I had been on a slippery slope for many years and after coming back from a break from my wife, I forced myself on her, she said no and I kept going, I needed to feel close to her again, I needed to feel loved. We didn't talk about it for some time but as time went on the damage started to show. I have never hated myself as much as I did once I realized what I had done. I had just started reading the sidebar and NMMNG at the time and my wife blamed my actions on the new book I was reading, and burned it. I DEER, I try to explain that if anything, reading the book sooner would of most likely prevented me from doing what I did. We went in for couples therepy but surprise surprise it solved nothing.
After months of living like roommates in separate bedrooms, I finally started to push things forward and came back to MRP, I have studied the sidebar, and read most of of the required reading, I'm going to the gym again now that it's open. And a lot of the concepts that I didnt understand before are starting to make sense. We've had sex twice in the last week, after the first time she told me she didnt enjoy it and that it felt like having sex with a friend. At the time I got butt hurt over it, she told me she doesnt want to have a sexual relationship with me, I believe this is one of two things, either it's a test or its genuine and I'm just not attractive enough yet. Either way it doesnt matter, I'm trying hard to make myself my own mental point of origin, I'm getting there slowly. I'm aware of the covert contracts I've made and have stopped that way of thinking,
Although I still have a mountain to climb I can see the changes within myself both mental and physical, I will become a man deserving of a great life, Its my wife's choice if she comes along for the ride or not.
WORK - I have made great progress at work, I've managed to apply myself to whatever task is in front of me, and focus on work, while at work. I was always focusing on my relationship 24/7 now not so much.
I got a slight pay rise, and am applying what I've learned here to my job, where possible; as a result most things are running smoother now.
FINANCIAL - I have squandered so much money over the past few years, I got tired of spending like a Frivolous nonce and decided to cut all none essential spending and save. This will serve as fuck you money, if or when the time comes.
My initial goal was to be able to pay the bills on time (instead of my wife paying and me sending her the money at the beginning of the next month) that's now taken care of. my next step is to pay off any money that has been lent to me by friends and family, then I want to reach £1000 in savings. This is not only achievable, but is quite a pedestrian goal. I am angry at myself for not dealing with this shit sooner.
GYM & DIET - getting back to where I was pre-lockdown, as someone who has never lifted prior to discovering this comunity, I feel there is much catching up to do, but that excites me. When I first started lifting I was doing it for my wife, as I'm sure many of us have, but the change in mindset has happened and I'm lifting for me now, nothing beats the satisfaction of seeing progress, seeing your man tits slowly turn into pecs is a thing of beauty. the path is laid out in front of me, I just need to follow it. I Aim to increase the weight as often as my body will allow.
I have started to meal prep for the whole week, this is allowing me to cut out the Takeaways and save more money.
SOCIAL - my friend who I train with is naturally very red pill aware and understands the process, even if he doesnt know the theory, he understands the necessity of lifting and creating dread, he is the only one that I will talk to when it comes to this kind of thing.
I need to branch out and make more effort socially, need to spend less time in the house and spend more time with my peers.
HOBBIES - I play Guitar in a band, this is a strange situation as my wife is the other guitarist and my stepdad is the singer, he's 60 and mostly a natural alpha, I have struggled in the past with jealousy especially when the two of them interact, now I accept that it is of my own creation, and that the only way it will get better is if I put in the work or leave the band, and since I'm not leaving, that only leaves one option. I will dedicate more time to practicing, and getting better at guitar as I have done very little on this front.
After reading a post about the importance of hobbies, I am looking for more, specifically some form of combat sport, something that will benefit me in the long run.
MISSION - to test my limits every day, to become the best man I can possibly be, both mentally and physically.
Goals for the coming week
-Buy a tape measure so I can work out, and track body fat percentage
-Set aside dedicated time to practice Guitar
-Start reading WISNIFG
-Open a savings account
-Push myself to increase weight, or improve my form in all my lifts.
Final note - I've tried to adhere to rule 9 as much as possible, but this being my first OYS I wanted to give as much context as possible, if it's not acceptable then I will accept my ban.
2wo2wo3hree 4y ago
a.) because you’re a sex validation seeking faggot, you wanted to know how sex with you made her feel and she told you the truth you couldn’t handle. That’s your fault.
b.) She literally sat there, knowing you’re a sex validation seeking faggot, and decided to poke you where you’re weak at. That’s your fault. Oh, yes, this was a shit test. You failed. That’s still your fault.
throw-away1715 4y ago
It's mostly B, but they both hit home, and are right on the money. Appreciate the feedback.
AlphalfaSprout 4y ago
What do you weigh?
throw-away1715 4y ago
Knew I'd forgotten something, 12 stone 5
ExactMammoth 4y ago
In American please
throw-away1715 4y ago
172 pounds
red-sfpplus 4y ago
My OYS:
/u/red-sfpplus: I think I have course corrected my ship. So hopefully less faggot texts from me lol.
/u/hornsofapathy: What changed with your ship?
red: If I am honest with myself I think it was a massive shit test by fitchick to see if I would actually “divorce” her if her and her kids do not live a life congruent with my own. The less Red Pill explanation its that I am a high value man who took in a woman and 3 kids with a vastly different standard than I will accept. Thru no fault of anyone there was alot of growning pain experienced by her and her kids to get to my standard while at the same time my patience ran out. It just so happens the things I demanded, were produced around the same time my patience ran out and I gave the non sexual FMOFY speech to her and her kids.
red: I have also ended my beta bux ways with her which were a BS safety net in the first place.
red: It takes time to make a diamond I suppose I could have summarized.
hoa: Takes time to cut it the way you like it. But you're the artisan.
hoa: Rambo didn't create shit he just blew shit up. Maybe the redpill reason is she wanted to feel "in her place" being with a HVM knowing she was/isn't as highly valued as you are with her "baggage".
red: You nailed it
Tyred_Biggums 4y ago
I'm curious - did they fight living up to that standard, not know how to do it, or just were incapable of meeting it?
I had a similiar situation with Nurse's kids bedtime. They were wild and asked for like a billion things (they're young). I told her this wasn't going to work for me as I wasn't going to be hanging around listening to that. Two days later - when she was laying with them to try and get them to calm down, I simply texted her that I'm going home and left. Cue to the sob story, apology and promises of "they'll get better".
It was also at that point she asked for help, I laid out the plan, she followed it. 1 week later no more issues.
I don't think she 1) thought it was that big of a problem and then 2) simply had no idea how to solve the problem without guidance.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
It wasn't a problem for her until it was a problem for you (and by proxy a problem for her kids too since it was unacceptable behavior).
She was trying to fix it with feelz like a woman would be expected to.
You likely implemented some direction, leadership, and a plan - as a man would be expected to.
And likely the actual plan was a combination of the two. That is your gift.
red-sfpplus 4y ago
13 words.
13 fucking words.
red-sfpplus 4y ago
You literally summarized.
It was first fighting and refusal.
Then they didn't know how and rejected initial guidance.
Finally had their epiphany moments (all 4 within the same week) where they realized in this order:
I would eject them from my life over this.
What I wanted wasn't that bad.
It benefited them as much, if not more than me.
My advice was actually spot on.
And it was on them to change if they wanted to stay.
Because my life is worth being in.
Edit:
It seems you issue was similar to mine. Boundaries, guidance, etc.
You had the benefit of being able to leave. They lived with me because I handed over some power to get what I want, which is co-habitation and monogamy with a woman.
You may have handled it better than I did.
I have a tendency to Rambo.
InChargeMan 4y ago
You? No...
Tyred_Biggums 4y ago
Exactly! Kids get the sleep they need, she gets to relax at night and not get all stressed. I get to work or read without people being loud. And there is more time for experimenting with leg spreaders, butt plugs, and restraints. Win-win-win.
My plans do include this but I'm in no rush to get there. Will be a minimum of 6 more months, but days I don't have my kids I'm over at her place. Having the option to leave certainly helps as it's easy enough to execute.
She never really resisted, just blew it off with promises. My mistake was assuming "promises" would lead to improvement. Needed a real plan. Easy plan, was tough for her (because feelz) to execute since it involved kids crying and being upset. I have the benefit with her kids and even my kids that I don't really care if they're upset that they have to do something good for them in the long run.
Cho_Assmilk 4y ago
OYS 2.0 #6
FITNESS/HEALTH
New job + Staggered hours for covid = hard time getting to the gym. Hopefully they loosen the restrictions, but with numbers going up I doubt it. Gonna have to do more work at home with dumbells to fill the void. Probably do most of my isolated lifting and keep the barbell work for the gym. As for the lifting itself, it's par for the course.
Been taking 1:1 edibles for sleeping for the last little while. If you stuggle with sleep and you're in a legal state, I'd highly recommend them.
MARRIAGE
This has been pretty well hiccup free. I guess I didn't have far to go, because my slip up wasn't very bad and she's used to seeing me in that way. Batting the shit tests like they aren't even there. This is honestly the main reason I'm here again and I'm happy how it's came back so easy.
ME
Still haven't talked to the family member who fucked in my last OYS. I truthfully can't or I think I'll lose my cool and say alot of shit I have pent up. Not that the shit isn't right and not that they don't deserve it, but I just don't feel like dealing with it. Maybe it's avoidance, but I'm cool with that.
My new job plus the side hussle has me pretty busy. I hope it's not gonna burn me out, but during these uncertain times, banking some extra cash ain't a bad thing. Have to play it by year (ear?).
RedBackedBadger 4y ago
OYS 39: Mid 30’s, 6’ 190lb, BF 11%, Separated, one kid 3yrs (f). OHP 138*9, Bench 193*11, DL 295*2.
Week Goals
Reading: MMSLP, MAP, Side Bar, Unchained male, models, The Eagle and the Dragon, WOTSM, WISNIFG, The dating playbook for men, The subtle art of not giving a fuck, The Rational Male, Awareness, Pook, NMMNG(x2), sex god method, no more bad kids, Practical female psychology, Meditation Book, non-redpill reading.
Physical: Be strong, fit, powerful and injury free into old age.
Joints are hurting, I’m going to take a 1-2 week deload and do blood flow restriction training.
Separation:
When I don’t do what ex wants I get multiple messages about what a shit person I am etc. For e.g. I got a message at 9pm asking if I could watch daughter the next day. I said no, she send numerous messages. I STFU. I am not at the point where it doesn’t faze me but it probably has 10-20% of the effect it did have on me and I’m happy with this progress. When we go to court in February I will ask for a clause preventing her sending these type of messages and preventing her discussing anything about the relationship with daughter to be included.
Mental/Mindset: Express myself authentically – be fully ‘me’
This week’s OYS feels weak I didn’t have any deep insights etc but I did feel better than I have in a while and was relatively productive.
T levels are still a pain, but I need to give it more time to see if the new does is working. The T doesn’t do much for my sex drive (which is high anyway and I don’t really want it higher) but when it’s working the feeling of overwhelm, constant background anxiety and not being fucked to do anything ‘goes away’. It’s hard to describe, I still get those feelings sometimes but they are proportional for e.g. if I am very stressed then I feel some overwhelm. But it’s not, have to go to shops – feel overwhelm.
A lot of what I do is still driven by avoiding feelings rather than genuinely being what I want to do. I am paying a lot of attention to this as I want to move into doing things that genuinely give me value rather than just stop some unhelpful mental model I have going on.
My self-esteem is improving, the parenting section below has helped this and is an example of Easys – keeping commitments to yourself. I have been working on being a better father and through effort and insight (my own and those instigated by people here) I have become who I wanted to be in that domain. I feel good about that and it’s something I have never seen clearly like in this example.
Parenting:
The other day, I picked her up from childcare, she was cranky and crying, she had a tantrum, she wanted her mom (which used to be a problem for me). She cried most of the way home, she was clearly tired, had a cough and the whole night was a ‘struggle’ – except that it wasn’t. That night after two hours of trying to get her to sleep, while she was still restless and lying on me as I sang to her and patting her back - I felt so privileged that I got to be there with her as a strong safe space. This is what I have been working towards as a father.
I’m looking at how to better incorporate her into my life so time with her isn’t just ‘do activity 1, then activity 2’ which are not helpful for my life but to do a mix of things that I need to get done and fun activities for her.
Career:
Been doing some thinking in this space, do I want to aim for director in the next 12 months or do I want to get experience in ops before moving up. I am also looking at moving out into consulting/training. Recently a consultant I knew contacted me and asked if I was interested in some work part time while I’m working at my current job. The benefits are they consult in the industry I would target and so that would give me good experience. The risk is that if my employer finds out they could fire me and I just don’t think it’s worth the risk at this point.
rotkohlblaukraut 4y ago
> When we go to court in February I will ask for a clause preventing her sending these type of messages and preventing her discussing anything about the relationship with daughter to be included.
Sounds like a Karen move. While I get it, it can get tiresome, (my ex used to do the same shit) work on controlling your own reaction in preference to controlling her behaviour.
> I’m looking at how to better incorporate her into my life so time with her isn’t just ‘do activity 1, then activity 2’
Time with your kid isn't mutually exclusive from the experience of living. Wierdly enough, one of my most pleasant childhood memories is of of going grocery shopping with my mom and finding a brand new shiny 1975 penny in the change. Just ordinary stuff can be an experience to connect and learn too.
RedBackedBadger 4y ago
re kids - that's a good example of what I'm working towards. I am making good progress here but I'm in a lock-down area which is a pain. Still getting her involved in jobs around the house. She helped me sharpen the chainsaw - what could go wrong...
The coin thing made me think - I am going to spend more time engaging with her on the little things and following her lead. So rather than getting the money out and having her count it and pay because I think that's going to help her grow - have more of a balance where I follow her and engage with what she thinks is interesting.
rotkohlblaukraut 4y ago
This is great. Some people parent as if they need to either entertain or distract their kids 24/7. Whether it's putting a DVD in the machine or planning them into 6 activity timeslots every day. Some spend time formally teaching them academic or worldy things, like how to cook, or do carpentry, or calculus, or manage money. Teaching is great. But it's also really important to connect emotionally, to teach them how to manage stress and the unfairness of the world, and manage and understand their emotions. Both by modelling for them in your own life, and by explanation and empathy. Helping them feel, identify, and work with the emotions that arise when they see the world is unfair and they're suffering. In that sense, the usual male approach to solve the problem by logic tends to fail with kids exactly as it does with women. Even if they accept your fix at some level, they crave that deeper connection and emotional learning. This doesn't have to be formal lectures, it can be what you do when stuff happens, like a problem at school or losing a favorite posession on the bus, or when good stuff happens too. Just... life.
RedBackedBadger 4y ago
That's what I'm after, I'm well on my way and at this point am 100% confident we'll get there. I think parents/the system try and 'teach' too much based on some conceptually 'perfect' way of looking at things but that's not how life happens. I want to be in the trenches with her showing her and helping her better understand what actually happens. Thanks for the input.
Tyred_Biggums 4y ago
So regardless of what the court orders, she may just go off and violate the order. Sure you can then go back to court and that's your prerogative. It wasn't worth it for me to do so. Here is what I did, YMMV
I had the court order to use our family wizard outside of emergencies. She's refused to do so. Cool, I could bring her back to court, but that's a pain in MY ass so I took a different approach.
STFU like you did. Literally, just STFU and ignore anything she says UNLESS it's logistics about the kid. Don't respond, don't acknowledge it. If she becomes harassing, save those texts because at some point you may want to leverage them.
The bigger question is why do you care those 10-20%?
Fighting anxiety for my whole life, I call this "normal anxiety". This is what most people would/should feel. It's a real emotion and just like any others is healthy to experience. Just don't dwell on it, let it stop you, recognize it for what it is any move on.
This is great! I'll tell you what. My relationship with my kids is off the charts great now. It's so much better when you can parent how you need to and give them what they need to grow and be good little humans even 50% of the time.
Not sure about your company, but we have pretty strict rules here. But if they're completely different industries/non competitors, I know we have allowed consulting outside on "spare" time.
RedBackedBadger 4y ago
Re 'orders' I'm in two minds here, as you, u/Blarg_Risen and u/rotkohlblaukraut have all pointed out - realistically all I can do is manage my behavior. In terms of why I might do it:
So on that, why do I still care?
I think the guilt is a result of the responsibility I feel for her emotions. I have a tendency to want to be in a relationships where I take on responsibility for the other persons emotions, it gives me a sense of purpose and allows me to avoid dealing with any of my own shit. I did it in a big way in my previous relationship and clearly I am still playing that out.
Does she still get like this? Does it affect you anymore?
I had no idea! I thought without mom and dad together she would suffer and all that - I was so wrong.
I decided against it, if my boss found out I could have been fired and the risk was not worth it at this point.
Tyred_Biggums 4y ago
I fully agree with you on the orders and the reasons why. Just don't think it will mean she'll follow them. Then you'll have to decide what's worth bringing back to court.
At some point... I can't pinpoint where - I just started finding everything she did or try to do funny. I guess it's amused mastery. No longer is it "I can't believe she would do that". It's "this is hilarious, look what she did now".
This is continued butt hurt on your part. If you have some legal right to try and prevent it - go for it. Or it may just make her better at hiding things. I have a pretty simple test: does this affect my relationship with my kids or put them in harms way? That's my criteria for involvement. If she wants to bad mouth me to others or do crazy shit in her own life - that's on her. It's unfortunate that someone can hate so much that it takes up that much of their mental energy.
Sure - but she does not owe you to reasonable. You do what YOU need to do without expectation on her. You're thinking "if I'm nice, she'll be nice".
This goes back to "I'm not an asshole". What's wrong with being an asshole? I'm an asshole in the sense that I put my needs above everyone else. With most people, but especially the STBX - I don't give a single fuck if she thinks I'm an asshole.
She has her moments. If I had to venture a guess, she still is trying to "one up" or use it as some sort of control/shaming tactic. It has become less and less. It does not affect me at all anymore. It used to for the first 3-4 months - when she would talk about her sleeping with so and so or when she would start bashing how bad of a parent I was. It's entertaining now looking back and sad. I do hope she can get her act together and make some good decisions going forward for her sake. I wish her a good life and hope she gets remarried or co-habitats ASAP.
The last thing that affected me - more so due to the affect on my daughter - was when she called the cops when my other kid got a small nip from my parents' dog. That was back in July.
RedBackedBadger 4y ago
This is all spot on, on some level I 'know it' but I am still struggling to make it part of how I think/feel on a day to day basis. It's a lot to keep in mind, over the next few week I'm going to focus on:
On some level I feel like if she is pulling shit, this is more likely to happen but I know that is wrong.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
I used to fight my (female) boss all the time about the petty shit she says and does. Then I stopped. Now I'm 100 times happier because I don't invest myself in it, and she needs to figure out a better way to get her feels from me. She's recently been trying to be more buddy buddy and act like she cares about me....hmmm....
RedBackedBadger 4y ago
I have been trying this strategy and it is helping but still plenty of crap. For all the reasons above I think it's still the right approach to continue with.
DirtyNuke 4y ago
OYS 60
Age 64 Ht 5'11" Wt 175 Wife 66 Married 44 Together 47
Physical
I'm collecting a list of medical issues to go over with a new doc (my first full physical in seven years) in a few weeks when you kids will be paying for everything.
She Section
Bear with me as I try to skirt Rule 9. I'm evaluating my progress over the past few months in a number of areas: eliminating the scoreboard, polarity first, shape of the vessel, being a stable adult ("captaincy"), eliminating covert contracts, etc, but to describe my observations I have to use the S-word. The observations are "emergent" - not things that I specifically meant to work on or improve, but things I'm noticing, and considering them as possible consequences of my other work.
A few of these behaviors have been around for a while, but all of them all together have built up in frequency and intensity.
My interpretation is that I am changing (have changed) for the better, and need to keep pushing.
Things I'm still working on
Comfort tests in general. Everything from recognizing them to responding appropriately and immediately. I still too often react autistically to avoid exposure of any vulnerability. There are times when it is part of the banter, and times when it is pure comfort. I've caught a few but not every one.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
You did fine, and for folks reading along this is the way to do it. You made keen observations from your own point of view about people in your life and what they've been doing in response to YOU.
When you start to live a life congruently to your core truth and desires with outcome independence, people take stock of this... and if they want to be a part of that life with you - they find a way to change their own behaviors to match your vision.
This is the proper use of the 1000ft rope analogy.
Why? What are you afraid of being exposed?
Do you not believe in yourself and your changes?
If you are afraid of being vulnerable, your frame is shit.
DirtyNuke 4y ago
My failure is I'm afraid to admit to her that I can be happy. It's part of what PON is helping with. First, to enjoy life as it happens, then let others know. I no longer feel she's the enemy, or even an opponent. There's at least another level (probably a few) I need to get to. A metric is my handling of comfort tests. My strategy is polarity until it breaks, then more polarity. Inculcating, then expressing thru physical action has probably been the biggest mindset shifter of my journey. I'm not "there" yet.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
What's so bad about admitting to her that you can be happy?
DirtyNuke 4y ago
That's exactly one of my key takeaways from PON. Letting it be ok is one of the things I work on from it. If I admit I can be happy, then do I set myself up for pain in the future? Another lesson from PON: let the future be in the future. I can be happy in this moment, and let that be enough. The "to her" part is to avoid the "don't consider her an opponent" as well as "don't make your happiness dependent on her". It's just a comfort test. That's all.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
One of the most freeing things I've allowed of myself is to be ok with being wrong.
Does sharing an idea now set you up for embarrassment in the future (if you're wrong)?
Does being happy now set you up for negative feelings in the future (if you're wrong)?
Does investment in your frame set you up for weakness in your future (if you're wrong)?
Being confident in your positive qualities and vision is but a piece of frame. But another piece is being confident you can handle the negatives of life too. One of those negatives is that the future will contradict your NOW. Learn to accept that, and let the blow hit you. Don't shield from it. And definitely don't spite yourself in the now in fear of it.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
Negative inquiry for noobs taking notes.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Lol there you go coach telling the team the entire gameplan again :)
Vegasman20002 4y ago
Man I don't get this. After 60 OYS this shouldnt be an issue.
DirtyNuke 4y ago
A few reasons. I never want to get complacent and think I've got it. I know it's a Red Queen's race. I can see progress but I know I'm not where I could or should be. And there's still huge areas I haven't even started on yet.
weakandsensitive 4y ago
If you constantly buy into hyperbole, you never focus on making it with for you.
DeadBruce 4y ago
OYS #1
32 years old, 5'7", 143lbs. BF: unknown (will measure as soon as possible, estimated around 14%). Married 6 years. Wife 36 SAHM, 2 step sons 10 and 11, daughter 5.
Readings: NMMNG, WISNIFG, SGM, MAP, most of the sidebar multiple times, a myriad of other books that aren't worth mentioning.
General: I've been lurking and LARPING for far too long. Almost a year at this point. My life is still a train wreck. Well no shit, I haven't done the work, so here I am.
Physical: BP: 80, SQ: 110, DL: 100, OHP: 80, BR: 105.
Its pretty clear from the numbers that I'm weak as hell. I've been on 5x5 SL for 2 weeks, lifting 3 days a week. I'll be keeping with it until it no longer benefits me. We'll see where I am in a year.
I've been on TRT since the end of May, and my numbers as of my last blood test are good right across the board no excessive estradiol, free T around 32, serum T around 1100. I gained around 10lbs without any lifting since starting, which is good, because I looked pretty much dead beforehand.
Diet is excellent, whole foods, no sugar, no booze, no junk. I do need to keep more careful track of my macros, though, as I tend to not eat enough.
Sleep is one area where I fail horribly. 5-6 hours a night is the norm. That's not enough to support my lifestyle plus lifting most of the time.
Mental: this is probably the worst area for me. I'm anxious, conflict avoidant, and nowhere near my own mental point of origin. I wouldn't know frame if it sat on my chest. I'll cave at the slightest hint of a disagreement, and have no confidence in my own choices. Somehow, at the same time, when left to my own devices, I'll act amazingly selfish and passive-aggressive. Typical Nice Guy behavior. A re-read of NMMNG is necessary, to include all of the exercises. Ill be starting that today.
I've been autopiloting through life without the first fucking clue of who I am, what I stand for, or what I want. Its time to grow up and figure this shit out.
Work/Finances: not bad, but not where I want to be. I'm debt free, with about 250k in retirement. That being said, I spend too much on projects and stupid stuff to keep my wife 'happy'. Saving more and investing more is what I need. Work performance is hit or miss depending on the day. Consistency is the issue. I lack the discipline to stay focused regardless of whatever else is going on in my life.
Relationship/Sex: dumpster fire. I've heard the word 'divorce' about 10 times in the last 4 years. I'm beginning to understand why. My lack of leadership has put my wife in the position of being my mother. There can't be anything more attractive than that. I run my mouth entirely too much, and have just recently started STFU. Things like AA/AM are out of the question until I'm a higher value man. I'm not the prize yet, so keeping my mouth shut is the only way forward.
Sex is an extremely sporadic thing. I'll go weeks with nothing but hard no's and blow-up fights, and then for a few days or a week, it'll be twice a day every day. Sometimes as much as 3 times in one night. I'm not too confident in initiating anymore, so building OI is important. Initiate daily, start gaming, and kino more. What happens happens.
I did initiate last night, got a yes, but then a random stomach issue came up for the wife. I'm sure it was an excuse because I've made her the prize for the last 8 years, but that's not the point. The fact that I wasn't butthurt actually surprised me.
Social/hobbies: I have hobbies, but I don't usually participate in them. That's on me. I'm always too worried about the 'honey do' list.
Most of my friends have moved away, and it's tough to find a group of like minded guys in the area. Really, I've been boring as fuck, and it sucks. I'm not a fun person right now.
Goals for the week:
Lift 3 times.
Do not neglect nutrition.
Begin NMMNG again, with exercises this time.
Initiate with the wife every day.
Talk to more people, get out of the comfort zone.
Start acting and speaking in a way that is consistent with what I truly believe and value. No BP illusions, no fantasy.
[deleted] 4y ago
[--removed--]
DeadBruce 4y ago
Not concerned with fertility. I'm done having kids.
[deleted] 4y ago
[--removed--]
ApostropheSs 4y ago
Don’t wait to apply AA and AM, just do it. Try it AA, make it ridiculous, try it out with other people first if you don’t want to try it with LTR. That is the best way for me to lighten up a situation
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
You just posted a retard question to ASKmrp. And you're on OYS #3. Stop giving other people advice and focus on you for now until you can unfuck even a smidgen of your own fuckery.
/u/DeadBruce don't listen to this fuck. You're right: AA/AM is a little too out of your league given your current mental models and actions. Good on you recognizing this. It would entirely come across and incongruent and try-hard asshole. Feel free to tell this guy to fuck off.
Vegasman20002 4y ago
Came here to say this. STFU and Lift (and eat). Work on that, DeadBruce. And STFU. AA/AM just doesn't work with no frame.
DeadBruce 4y ago
Thanks Mr Horns. I had no intention to follow that advice. I appreciate the feedback.
ExactMammoth 4y ago
A huge part of mrp is finding the advice that fits and applying it with rigor.
Good to see you are already learning this.
You are already following the best advice for oys1. Sidebar, lift, stfu. Do that for a while.
ImpatientZen 4y ago
OYS #18
40, 6’0 191lbs, Married 15 years, wife 40, son 6yo.
OYS 101
Recent lifts: SQ347,5x2, BP255x1, PR175x2, DL445x2.
Read: Most things twice. WISNIFGx4 and NMMNGx3. Currently Day Bang.
STFU: Progressing.
Basics: Social, leading, hygiene, family, diet, training, no porn, no fap, no alcohol all fine.
Mindset
Things are really good these days. Sleep is almost normalized, which would be the first time I can say that since I started the unfucking process about two years ago.
Generally pretty happy feel engaged and motivated. It has taken some work and shit posts but impatience and guilt is lessening. Things are moving in the right direction and settling in my head.
I still talk too much and think too much, when I should just be painting by numbers. I realize that this energy could and should be used on following and continuing to elaborate on my roadmap.
Game and sex
Things are fine but what I can own this week is not creating enough space for sex. It is generally taking up less headspace these days, which is good and a needed phase I think. Having realized this, I am starting to be a bit more ambitious here.
At home: Things are cool. I passed some shit tests pretty well. Mostly just ignored them (pretty sure there were some I didn’t even see) but every once in a while I spend a phrase or two on Explaining. Didn’t fuck much during the week, as I was busy with work and other shit. Too busy, perhaps. I took a few BJ’s (shark week), they are on demand in pretty much all situations and all timings - even got an unexpected one almost out the door to work. All fine and enjoyable. I am implementing some deep throat training, but I could be more consistent.
Outside: I am reading Day Bang. I forgot how good it is. And how much I actually enjoy the process of it. Day game is fun. I considered just running out and approaching. But the more I read the more I see that I have been a chump and awful conversationalist at home. So I will begin with my wife. Otherwise my focus can get drawn to easier targets (again) and not lead in the direction I want. I will eventually set aside some time to game strange, it's fun.
Social and family
I am doing fine here. Sports stuff with the kid and other men, some solo stuff where I got to chat to some new people, all good.
I am not consistently doing interesting new stuff on my own. I think joining another club/society of some kind would be smart. Meet new people and learn new things.
Physical
Weight stabilized as expected. I am definitely in a deficit, so just staying the course, hoping to see a more slow and stable drop over the next weeks. Still easy to adhere to - basically IF 2 meals a day stuff. I might be a bit low on protein, but 150+/day at least. Weekends I also skip breakfast but then ramp op the kcals and carbs. Will be a bit more controlled if I don't start losing a bit.
Workouts and runs went fine. Lifts are suffering a bit, but nothing major. I will just dial down 5%, auto regulate from there. I think keeping lifts in shape should be fine, setting me up for great progress in a month or so when I transition back out of diet and cruise for a while.
Work
Overall this is good, if taking a lot of time and energy. I am a bit too busy, but not too worried about the stuff that gets left to last minute. Have new hires decided and in process to come in. I do have to develop some new business if I want to reach my level of ambition, so I need to attribute some time to that.
I had a talk with troublesome employee. Still hard to get the message through, and I was probably too much WISNIFG and too little in direct authority mode. Then figured out some stuff done behind my back, inadvertently involving several other of my people who came to me because they didn't appreciate it. This at least changed that dynamic, as I had to give another very direct reprimand, which unfortunately still seemed to fall on rather deaf ears. I have tried to get this turned around but we are beginning to enter last chance saloon.
part_wolf 4y ago
You don't seem very purposeful about how you choose to spend your time. Are you this halfhearted and ineffectual in real life?
ImpatientZen 4y ago
Fuck me. I appreciate the effort in picking out those 8(!) weak qualifiers/statements. Jesus - that's awesome. It's amazing how I didn't see this myself. Definitely some mental stuff to shit here. Thanks man.
Deathmetal_deadlifts 4y ago
Can you expand a bit on how you're using Day Bang in conversations with your wife? I just read it too and I arrived at the same conclusion as you. I struggle with implementing it to improve conversations at home.
Also, have you actually used the pet store opener?
ImpatientZen 4y ago
I guess I should preface this by saying that any difficulties in this area is 80% me being unattractive and not displaying High Value for a long fucking time, meaning dear wife just isn't really interested. Another 15% is then that the stuff I care about never was within her sphere of interest or competence even at the best of times.
Then 5% is just me being a retard with conversation. In stead of dropping bait and letting her get intrigued etc. I'd do brute force and just drop all the knowledge in one go. Nothing to ask about, nothing to pursue. That's what Day Bang reminded me.
I haven't used any openers. I have no problem talking to strangers, it's even part of my job. I will eventually but I am careful as it will just strengthen my experience of having a much better and interesting time with other women than my wife. I will want someone who actually is fun to talk to and who makes me think. For now, wife gets the chance to be that someone. Day Bang can help (a little) with that and a lot if I eventually open for auditions.
InChargeMan 4y ago
You've come a long way, congrats. You are about in the right place to start getting complacent. Don't do that. Do you have your goals, targets and plans for executing worked out? Keep that shit locked down tight, make your plans and continue to execute until you have reached those targets, only then can you change the goal posts. From what I can tell you are now living the "best case" for the vast majority of BP men out there, which is dangerous. You got some cheese, don't let it distract you from the much bigger piece that lays further into the maze. There isn't just one red pill.
One example of "more than one red pill" is your consideration of your wife's cycle. Standard RP theory is not to spend your time worrying about this in that your expectations for your wife should not lessen (i.e. get a free pass) based on her period. This makes a lot of sense, in that it is a great way to allow a slippery slope back into her frame. "Well, she disrespected me, but it was only because she is PMSing....Well, she only ignored her responsibilities because she is on her period...Well, she exchanged numbers with guys at the bar because she is ovulating...etc" Yes, it is a challenge for her in that she does in fact have physical struggles and emotional changes due to her cycle, but also, that's her burden and somehow she can figure out how to deal with it for the rest of the world, why not you? The typical RP man needs to spend most of his time figuring out his own shit, not tip-toeing around his wife's head.
With that being said, as you push into higher levels of MRP, and as you start pushing her and your relationship into places that are mentally and physically demanding, it is very helpful to understand yourself and your woman from a psychological and physiological standpoint. There is also the ebb and flow of the relationship. You mentioned consistency in deep-throat training. That is something that definitely has an ebb and flow, consistency is not necessarily a good thing. It is too much for me to get into right now, but when you understand the hedonic treadmill, the dopamine cycle, plus the effects of ovulation on a woman, you can learn how to better play the instrument that is a woman for maximum progress. Her period is actually a good thing in many ways, it gives you and her time to reset.
This wasn't intended as a lesson or even actionable information, just a preview, if anyone is reading this and hasn't fully mastered themselves yet, understand that you are not in the position to waste even a minute thinking about how other people in your world function, get yourself in line first. For the 1% out there, the rabbit hole goes deep.
ImpatientZen 4y ago
As always I really appreciate the input. It made me think and work something out.
First off I totally get the complacency thing. It's a long storybut short version I lived the "best case BP" for some years, but felt there was more. I considered nuking but in stead went and found it with other women (including D/s) than my wife. Then for some reason decided that integrity+honesty were non-negotiable for me. So came clean and after some drama I decided to try and see if I could create this life with the wife. Lots of shit to shovel, but it gave me the burning platform (as per sleep issues) to do the GD work.
This seems to have gotten me and the relationship back to baseline. The mildy dissatisfying "best case BP". Maybe even a bit above. But I know from experience there is (much) more, and I wont - cant even - settle for less. A lot of the fun is actually what you describe. That kind of physical and psychological connection and dynamic. I tried it before and it really enriched my life.
A missing piece I think you've given me is that sucking at validation/comfort dare I say leading according to her mental/physical state. I know this is holding me back. I think it's at least 6-8OYS' ago 223 poked me a bit. But something shifted now, as to how it fits in the life and relationship I want.
And then, since this is OYS. I do have my goals, targets, plans, but you still put your finger on it. I need to really, really make it concrete, actionable, measurable even more than I already have.
I know that it is my thinking/talking shit that holds me back from getting the energy invested in this. At least I am improving.
Thanks again man. This is hugely helpful in keeping hope that indeed this "best case BP" isn't it. Now that I think of it, the fear of it being so is actually one of the reasons I've been so eager to nuke I think.
SoggyTrain 4y ago
Jesus. I still pay attention to my wife's cycle. My rational is so that when she gets moody and depressed 5 days before her period I can be sure not to take it personally even for a millisecond (which I shouldn't anyways).
Lot's of value in your response to OP for me.
InChargeMan 4y ago
You proved the exact point, never take it personally. Your frame should be formed with an internal locus of control. Do you get mad at the cloud when it rains? If she has a bad day it has nothing to do with you.
2wo2wo3hree 4y ago
ImpatientZen 4y ago
Good question. I'll try to answer. In short I started having sleep issues when I blew everything up whereas usually it was no issue. Lot's of weird dreams and stuff, really fucking with my quality of life and performance. Quite directly related to my relationships. It got a bit better throughout the time I've worked on figuring shit out - and really started getting better once I worked through all my BS "reasons" and shit, as per last say 6-8 OYS'.
No science. What it felt like was that I was incongruent, that I had stuff I didn't want to face and process, that I was missing something, and it woke me at night, impacting my life. It seems I've processed most of that stuff, hence better sleep and life.
I don't know if that makes sense. Basic point is that I knew something had to change so I could sleep and perform. I worked through some shit and it changed. Correllation isnt always causation of course, but it's cool either way.
xxxthrowmeawayxxxx 4y ago
if you have time and care about dreams. Man and his Symbols by Jung. Most accessible of his writings.
rotkohlblaukraut 4y ago
It sounds like you've gone from a place of complacent not-quite-comfortablness-but-not-really-that-bad-ness to something that seems almost happy. I'm glad for you. I still get the feeling that you're running a program without really knowing why or where you're going though. Couple weeks back you were talking divorce and I got the sense that it was partly because every new MRP'er has an angry divorce fantasy in the back of his head and that resonated with you. After some feedback from other guys, you dialled that back. How much of those decisions were yours from your true self, how much were just for the sake of following the playbook? Not to shit on you, if you know where you're going, great, but I have a hard time picking it out from your posts sometimes.
ImpatientZen 4y ago
I really appreciate the comment. The ones you've given me throughout have been incredibly helpful. You, once again, put your finger on the sore spot:
In honesty, it's mostly the latter. I had an inner peace when I was in "divorce mindset". It just felt right, and it felt good to trust myself and my feelings. Something one should do at some point, once one is not a fuckwit, as you aptly put it. I dont feel I am there yet. "OYS for a year" was my initial timeline, and I don't feel it is too far off to say that I'm about one third in.
At least my experience shows the value of following the programme. And even if I might already know that my current woman isn't up to spec and can't be brought to be, I've learnt so much by not nexting.
If I am really honest I can't say that I'd be doing as much (if any) work on the deeper shit if I didn't have this burning platform of being only "almost happy". The easiest thing in the world would be to just have a couple of women in rotation (plates?). I don't even particularly enjoy the family-lifestyle so as long as I didn't shack up with anyone, I could keep that up pretty well I think, even in a somewhat-fucked state. But I'd stay there.
Further, even this might be a fantasy. Looking at my own case history and some of the guys on here that did nuke, it seems eventually one ends up something like the same place - having a woman to handle, having to work through the same shit. So I'd rather do that now in my current situation than 1-2-3 years down the road with someone else.
ICM has underscored the importance of making the plan concrete with timelines. I am a master of doing that usually. I even know what should be in it. I know what is an acceptable relationship is and isn't. Yet I have procrastinated here. I have it in broad strokes in my head, but I will go back to filling it out on paper.
I know I am wordy. Writing shit out helps me. Once again thanks for the input. It really helps.
rotkohlblaukraut 4y ago
Just to beat that horse one more time, make sure that when you make a concrete plan (for whatever area in your life), those "should"s and "acceptable" judgements are coming from you and what you want and decide, not just from some list of bullet points on the internet.
ImpatientZen 4y ago
I appreciate the horsebeating. Actually this bit. What I want from a relationship and what is acceptable, that I am actually very clear about. I know exactly how that looks.
I did get lost for a while, trying to BP. What this place has done (and mostly NMMNG and WISNIFG) is help me come to my senses and make peace with how I am and what I want.
I just have to chart the course there. I think I'm pretty well underway.
ApostropheSs 4y ago
OYS#3 – 35 6’0 185lbs, 15% BF / Married 8 Years, Together 11 / 2 kids ( 7 and 4)
Read – NMMNG, MAP, Sidebar, WISNIFG
Reading – MMSLP, The Rational Male.
Health and Fitness – I read over Stronglifts 5x5 website over the weekend. Holy Shit. I have been doing it wrong. I have a home gym set up I like and I have been working out consistently over the past 6 months. I have a 3 x week regiment that I follow religiously. I have seen results from training, I have become fit and athletic, but not strong. Fit can be attractive, but my goal is to be more dominant, so I need to be strong, not just fit. Now immediate plan is to change workout to focus on Squats, Deadlifts, loaded push ups, chin ups and dips. Follow the stronglifts workout A and B, I will have some stats to post in the coming weeks.
Goal – Lifting - 3 x week, Run/HIIT - 1 x week, Yoga - 1 x week. 120g Proteins, tracking total calories
Financial –Next 3 quarters at work will have a very large target due to recent success. Need to keep sales trend up, no time for dip. Also Waiting for neighbor’s house to officially list, so we can set up a walk through and decide if it will be a sound investment property. I spoke with their realtor last week, she said new laws are in place so we can not look at house or make an offer until it is officially listed. My realtor is checking daily to be on top of it when it lists. Don’t want to get oneitis over income property though. I will start looking for other possible income properties in my area.
Goal – Set up sales to finish 2021 strong, move forward with income property, find one other potential income property.
Family – As in past OYS, I see more and more improvement in using NMMNG and WISNIFG communication techniques with kids and other family members. Went to a family gathering this weekend had a great time. I used to be such a beta bitch around my wife by her family, it was pathetic. I use the principle from NMMNG, anytime I feel like I need to do something for somebody else. I stop and do something for myself instead. Need to keep doing this for another week or so. I have curbed a lot of nice guy and beta behaviors, but they are still my default response, I have to actively think about not doing something, rather than naturally do what I want. Need to keep building frame.
Social – Had friends over this weekend, grilled out in the backyard and let kids play. I posted a question in askMRP about low sex marriages as the norm, this couple is one of those low sex marriages. I got some great responses and was motivated to not let effect my mission and my behavior. I flirted with my wife, even when there was a snippy response, or no response, I kept it up. There was a moment when I was alone with friends wife, we were talking and helping kids bike, I made joke and I saw her look at me and bite her lower lip and look down slyly. Its an extremely small victory, but working out and dressing and grooming better has had noticeable improvements.
Goals, - Have friends over again this weekend. Set up bike ride with son and friend. Band practice 2 x month.
Relationship – In about 2 months MRP has cut out all of our fights. We don’t fight anymore. Don’t get me wrong, I get bitched at..alot. We disagree, I broken record and fog, or just straight up STFU, sometimes I literally STFU and lock eye contact. It feels super awkward, and I am always have the urge to DEER and prove that I am right, but I resist. I drew a hard boundary the other day. The first time in my life I said the words “I am drawing a boundary, do not act that way again”. I am getting very good at using the principles. But I keep coming back to the “Why?”. Am I doing this shit just to get laid more? Am I doing this shit to have a D/s relationship? Am I doing this shit to have a plan if the bomb is dropped on my marriage? I found this site to have more and better sex with my wife, and I have seen improvements in a pretty short amount of time. But I am staying here because I found frame, or I should say I found out how weak my frame is. I am staying to build a fucking monster frame.
Goals – Frame, from the second I wake up till I fall asleep, stay in frame all day, all week. Think about it all fucking week, ask every fucking decision “does this build my frame?”. By the end of the week, I want to be so fucking sick of working on my frame, so sick overthinking everything, but I also want to know every cross bar, every screw, every weak point, every god damn crack in my frame so I know what I have and I know where to build. I’ll let you know how it goes.
threekindsoflucky 4y ago
Dancing monkey
This isn't how frame works. You don't build it. You either have it or you don't.
weakandsensitive 4y ago
You guys have /u/johneyapocalypse to thank for taking the youtube video series main stream. Having /u/HornsOfApathy on made it so I had to plan out the timing.
We've gotten good feedback and I'm glad you guys get value out of them. More importantly, I enjoy doing them.
For the near terms, Horns and I are scheduling a regular Sunday stream from 9PM-10:30PM EST.
If you want your OYS post to be highlighted, send me a PM. However, if too many of you delete your account because you're a soft whiny bitch (/u/Creamy_Sm00th), I'm going to start putting prices on spots.
If there are too many of you that sign up, I might start auctioning spots too. I'm guessing this won't happen though. And if it does, it won't happen until we have a regular cadence. But there you go, there's expectation management for you.
Here's the youtube link - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3FG0jQOQc8
johneyapocalypse 4y ago
You did good work w&s.
[deleted] 4y ago
[--removed--]
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
It was definitely a fun time. Thanks to all you guys who reached out via PM with feedback and thank you's.
Last week we discussed /u/sodarishnod - /u/Tulkas820 - /u/arm_candy - /u/Stoic_Wrangler - /u/Creamy_Sm00th (gay deleted out) - /u/Step_Aside_Butch - /u/NowEntertheArena - u/ManImproving
If you're fat I'm going to call you really fucking fat. And probably laugh at how fat you are. Being not-fat is easy. If you're fat right now, start being not fat. Stop eating shit and buy some giftcards to McDonalds (our largest RedPill official sponsor) and mail them to /u/johneyapocalypse he handles all the money
This message is brought to you by Tony Hawk Pro Skater 1+2, now available on PC/XBOX/PS4 and McDonalds (i have to mention them twice contractually)
sodarishnod 4y ago
I checked it out this week for the first time and heard your feedback on mine. Very helpful commentary and richer set of points and perspective than just the written comments here.
Particular point for me was "stopping talking in future tense." True.
Thanks, Sod
Vegasman20002 4y ago
Is there a link for it?
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
9/15/2020 Edition
RStonePT 4y ago
They are starting to get traction. Really cool concept
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
If you could play THPS instead of Tekken on twitch it would really help us out (Love the twitch concept bro - ingenious for internet nerds)
RStonePT 4y ago
Thps?
Edit oh... Lol, can't justify buying a new game until Twitch revenue increases
ExactMammoth 4y ago
Go home and look in your room at your mom's house. THPS will still be there. I promise.
Turn up the soundtrack please.
RStonePT 4y ago
Yeah, DMCA would fucking love that
Deathmetal_deadlifts 4y ago
OYS #49
Stats: 40 yo, height 186 cm, weight 86.5 kg, bodyfat 15% navy method, wife 39 yo, living together for 13 years, married for 9. Kids are 3 (girl) and 6 (boy).
Lifting stats (heaviest weight at the last workout): BP 90 kg x5, SQ 110 kg x4, DL 142.5 kg x6
Readings:
Sidebar books read: MMSLP, NMMNGx2, WISNIFG, RM, TWOTSM, MAP, Saving a low sex marriage, Bigger Leaner Stronger, Pook, SGM
Books read that are not on the sidebar: Bigger Leaner Stronger, Leangains, Kettlebell Simple and Sinister, The Quick and the Dead, Fuccfiles, Unfuck Yourself, Day Bang, Personality Isn’t Permanent
Now reading: 48LOP, Bang
Reading queue: Mystery Method, Models
Shit to own
Action items from last OYS:
- At least 2 more conversations, with some bait prepared. Need to set some time to do this and prepare an opener
Fail. I did not schedule time for this in the calendar and therefore it did not happen.
- Runs a quick experiment. Stop jerking off completely (now it’s like once a week) and only cum in my wife, see how long that can last
Spectacular fail. Fucked my wife once then got horny, indulged in fantasies and initiated every evening for four days straight. We did not have sex during those four days, because [Rule 9]. I felt full of energy and pumped up, until around yesterday when I got a dull throbbing pain in the prostate area. Last night I woke up to go to the bathroom three times. Experiment is over and it seems unsafe to resume.
Kids: I took my son and we did a boys’ trip out of town, just the two of us. We did some rope climbing together, we both loved it.
Action items for next OYS:
- None. I am going on a business trip and will be working during the days and drinking with coworkers at night.
Mission/ long-term stuff
• By March 2021: join the 1000-pound club
• In the next 2-3 years: become a C-level executive in my current company or a better one. This will require me to improve my energy levels and charisma, get rid of nice guy behaviors, become an impatient and demanding boss for my direct reports and also be a leader at home. If I do all that it’s mission complete
• Help my kids grow confident and strong, so that they make the big life decisions driven by ambition as opposed to driven by fear
arm_candy 4y ago
No jerking off for 4 days and suddenly you’ve got prostate problems. I don’t think so. I don’t care if you jerk off or not but this is ridiculous. Your experiment was presumably intended to make you hornier. It sounds like it succeeded. Somehow you’ve decided that feeling is unsafe.
Deathmetal_deadlifts 4y ago
Normally 4 days would not be a problem yes. I initiated every night after being horny for most of the day. And I had some possibly mild form of BPH to begin with.
arm_candy 4y ago
Then go to a fucking doctor instead of self diagnosing as “need to jerk off”.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Literal butthurt from not jacking off. Ain't buying it.
Deathmetal_deadlifts 4y ago
For years I avoided the bench press because of an old shoulder injury. I bench press now. Both shoulders hurt, not just the 'bad' one. I research good form, I ask a spotter to look at where my elbows are going and so on. I'm sure there are people out there who legit should not bench press. I think I'm not one of them, with 85% confidence.
I'm sure there are people out there who should not practice nofap because of prostate issues. Whether I am one, how the fuck do I know. I'll find out at some point.
rotkohlblaukraut 4y ago
> practice nofap because of prostate issues.
Probably just a form issue
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
I am hoping that bolded part is a typo.
In your last OYS you posted about how your CEO told you that you needed to fire people with more "empathy". He wasn't wrong, but I'm guessing you looked at this guy and said "what a bluepilled beta bitch". He knows how to play the game.
I think it's time you read 48 LOP if this is a goal of yours, because you fucking suck at it. You don't understand the first part of what it takes to be a C-level guy. I am one, and thought the same as you once.
Guys that make it to this level got (and stayed) here for a reason. Sure, there are overbearing, impatient and demanding C-level guys out there - but you know what? They don't last long at all. They attempt to use brute force to move people in a direction because they SUCK at leadership playing the long game. The goal is not to move people your direction. The goal is to get people to want to move in your direction. That is a subtle difference. One uses force. The other uses "manipulation".
When you fire a guy without any empathy - what the fuck does that accomplish? Does it stroke your alpha ego? Does it make you feel like "Yeah man, FUCK YOU AND I'M THE DEMANDING MOTHERFUCKER HERE". What the fuck dude? Is the point of it to fire someone so that others are scared of losing their job?
Fear is a motivator, sure, but inspiration is a stronger one.
Get your mind straight about this. Being a C-level guy is all about playing the long game and understanding what it is that people need in order to thrive.
There is a huge perception that most C-level guys are downright assholes that get shit done and I think you're trying to live up to that image. Here's the secret though: I am with these kind of dudes all day long. Yes, they have the perception of being assholes because they have to make all the difficult decisions for the company (which no employee really wants to make). Things like - Do I let go of 10% of my staff, or cut everyone's pay by 10%? Or kill bonuses for the exec team for a quarter? Who the FUCK wants to make that decision? You? Well, if you make that decision people are going to think you're an asshole no matter what, no matter how much you try to explain, or whatever you want to do. So there is always a perception that C-suite dudes are assholes. It's just not true.
There is a reason they got to the top and that reason is that they know how to manipulate people the best. It's mostly unconscious manipulation (ahem: leadership), but it is what it is.
So what I'm trying to say is this: You know nothing about the mentality of a C-level guy. It's not a "fun" job but it is rewarding in many other ways. You get to watch your leadership blossom and be amplified within an organization - all of which requires empathy and understanding what it is that motivates and moves people the most.
Otherwise you'll see whatever company you join or grow in fail long term. You can certainly get in there and give them a "coffee is for closers" speech and fear the fuck out of them - and then maybe get out in 2-3 years with a parachute if that's your goal... but that will be as long as you last. Because as soon as you're out? You phone won't be ringing for the next gig.
Long story short: Sidebar. Graduate level. Also tagging /u/johneyapocalypse - because we're both C-level "beta-bitches with empathy" if he wants to give his take.
part_wolf 4y ago
A high capacity to influence people.
Understanding what it is that people need in order to thrive.
The willingness to make decisions that other people don't want to make.
Empathy and understanding what it is that motivates and moves people the most.
Playing the long game.
This last one just sounds like strategy, but I'm not sure that's what you mean. Would you elaborate?
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Patience in most people is in short supply. So is changing one's mind (mental models).
Making hard decisions in the short-term is what people struggle with the most. Next, they struggle with making different decisions once already set in a path. Both require long term vision and few people have the balls and ego-loss required to execute. With this knowledge you take on the burden of guilt and they are absolved of it, which is short term "pain" (not really) for executing on the long game strategy.
SBIII 4y ago
​
​
Unless you plan on getting fat, I'd push that deadline out by a few months.
Deathmetal_deadlifts 4y ago
That's all true, though I did not think my boss was a blue pill beta bitch. I've been thinking about what he told me and I know he was right. For the record, he is both demanding and impatient but is able to inspire loyalty like no one else I've seen.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Still a shit mental model.
He likely has clear standards with established boundaries and expectations. AKA: Frame. Not demanding and impatient like a Nice Guy fucktard. The words you use say more than you know.
Stoic_Wrangler 4y ago
\^Have you considered making this into a post? This is golden.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Brother - I have like 13 posts in draft that I can't find the time to complete. Maybe I'll do what I did before and list them all out so people can tell me what would be the most beneficial to the community so I can focus my time.
I have a problem where if I take the time to do them, I want to do it right so it's easily digestible to a large audience of noobs and vets - and I struggle to shorten the amount of words and examples I use when explaining what I think are easy concepts for me, but complex ones for others.
InChargeMan 4y ago
Yes, yes you do :)
Cloudy_Pirate 4y ago
I can’t even imagine how much dread Horns must have created the first few time he STFU. “He’s not talking to me... he MUST be talking to someone else”.
part_wolf 4y ago
This was exactly what my wife thought when I first started shutting my big fat mouth.
Stoic_Wrangler 4y ago
Man, I think at this point people would read the post you write regardless - I'm sure any of the 13 posts are relatable. This reply to Deadlifts struck a chord with me as I think its a terrible misconception that "all C level peoplez are a-holes" and don't think I'm alone in wanting to hear your perspective at the level, especially coupled with your experience here, etc.
Also, I appreciate the feedback on the live stream.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
In the end, it's all about people wanting to blame someone for making hard decisions that they would never want to make. They hamster they'd "do better" but if put in the same position they would be absofuckinglutely paralyzed and make no decision at all.
I make decisions for a living. Hard ones. I can remember the first time many years ago I had to let go of about 70+ people all at once. They were good people, we lost a key account, and they had done nothing wrong. I didn't make a direct mistake for it happening, but I was responsible for it. I was having a lot of difficulty emotionally reconciling the fact that I was about to negatively effect the lives of all these 70+ families. With one decision I was about to turn lives upside down in all kinds of ways. People that I loved to work with. People that I spent time with their kids.
Ultimately I came to three conclusions:
1) You are empowered by the rest of the leadership staff to make these kind of decisions because you have a trusted track record of making good decisions. If you make bad decisions everyone knows. If you make good decisions only other C-level guys know.
Takeaway: Don't live in other people's frame. Make the best decision you can, always.
2) You are paid, very well, for learning the personal skill of how to deal with the personal emotional fall out of making difficult decisions. It is not an easy job, and you are paid accordingly. Having empathy for those involved does not make that harder or easier. It is human, and that is preferred.
Takeaway: Have frame, believe in yourself.
3) The higher you go, the lonelier it becomes.
Takeaway: At the mountaintop there is no one to validate your frame. Only you.
​
The reason that we're up there at the top is because we actually really really care about the people who work for us. If you've ever sat down with 70+ people in two days, one-on-one, and told them they are being let go... it's not fun. Fuck no. But inside of me now I make better decisions because I don't want to have to go through that again, and I'll build a business where I minimize the risk of my (or my staff's) mistakes. Every decision I make is a calculated risk of effecting lives.
And sometimes I make decisions that will positively effect lives.
The only measure of success I've found in my career is this: Have I created more jobs and/or positive success for people than I have destroyed lives/jobs? It's never primarily about money.
There is a reason only a few make it to the C-suite. Everyone at high levels of a company are usually great, but it's because people believe in us, no matter how much of an asshole they might think we are that takes us that last step and keeps us there wanting to work everyday at how hard this job could be.
Stoic_Wrangler 4y ago
This is great stuff, I appreciate you sharing. I'm realizing as I get older that leaders are just like everyone else, just with immense responsibility for big decisions that affect others that most people wouldn't have the balls or frame to do. A good reason why strong leaders are so rare.
ManImproving 4y ago
OYS #35
Mid-thirties, 6'2", 180 lbs, 12% bf Navy Method, married over a decade, multiple young kids.
Lifts: SQ 5x255 lbs, BP 5x220 lbs, OHP 5x135 lbs, DL 5x335 lbs.
Goals: Be the oak for my family. Develop my side business. Increase my SMV to become the man I want to be.
Readings: Most of the sidebar.
Financial: One of the projects for my side business entered a new phase that will require a lot of work from me. It’s a welcome change of pace. I like being busy.
Social: I fell short in this area. There was no casual sports event this weekend, and I wasn’t proactive with replacing it. I won’t let that happen again.
I bought a compound bow. One of my long term goals is to bow hunt. I’d love to bring in some of my own meat. This is a first tentative step in that direction. Once it’s too cold outside for some of my other activities, I’ll switch to indoor archery to start learning the necessary skills. It’s going to be a long road, but I’m looking forward to it.
Physical: I’m having a rough transition from Stronglifts 5x5 to 5/3/1 BBB. 5/3/1 depends on 1 rep maxes as the starting point and then takes percentages off of that. I never tested my one rep maxes, so I used estimated 1 rep maxes based on my five rep maxes. You can see where this is going. Despite what the formula said, my estimated one rep maxes for overhead press and squats weren’t realistic, and I had to deload in the first two weeks of the program. I’m hoping I can start to make slow, steady progress with these new, lower estimates. Overall, I like the volume of the 5/3/1 BBB program, but I’m going to have to work through a few issues before it’s optimized for me.
Fashion: It finally got cold here, so I got to bring out the pants I bought that have been hanging uselessly in my closet during shorts weather. I’m having fun putting together new outfit combinations.
Marriage: I got in one brief argument with my wife, which never should have happened. I was being passive, and that led to shit tests. I need to be a leader in all family situations and use STFU as necessary. Verbal intercourse is optional.
Sex: The second round of fooling around during period week was much better than the first. The sex after the end of period week was solidly meh. Her attitude was so bad that I actually stopped mid-thrust and said it wasn’t working for me. I initiated again an hour later, and the sex improved, but I’ve definitely had better. I need to remember that my wife’s desire for me is not the measure of who I am as a man. As I improve, she might be more attracted to me, or she might not. All I can control is me, and I’m killing it right now, regardless of what anyone else thinks.
Mental: I continue to put myself first. I refuse to feel guilty about it. The only one who truly cares about me is me.
SBIII 4y ago
Fashion is sooo much fun.
https://www.reddit.com/r/marriedredpill/comments/g7drug/60\_dod\_2020\_week\_4\_style\_got\_chucks\_on\_with\_saint/
2wo2wo3hree 4y ago
This takes a certain amount of Beta behaviors. You won’t achieve this until you get beyond hating your wife. Being the oak takes “care” , “service” and “masculine leadership”.
THAt! You are...
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
I'm have been bow-hunting exclusively for many years.
Shoot 100 arrows everyday for a month at 20, 30, and 35 yards and set your pins accordingly. Your sight is important. I recommend a 3-pin TruGlow for beginners. I also recommend a kisser button for beginners and a release. Practice shooting under different circumstances. Standing on a chair. Kneeling. On a ladder. I presume you'll be hunting big game. When it comes to harvesting an animal it gives you their life. That is not a time to live beyond your edge (yardage).
Bowhunting is all about calming the mind down in the height of adrenaline and focusing on one thing: technique and your target.
If you're meditating as part of your journey it will help.
Do this for 3-4 weeks and you'll be ready to hunt confidently. Just get out there and enjoy fucking everything up. It's hard as fuck to get big game within 30 yards. You'll fuck up alot, but the feedback is instant and you know immediately what you did wrong to fuck up your hunt.
Kind of like pass/fail a shit test. But from a deer.
It's never too cold to shoot a big buck, bro. Don't be gay.
I never got into 3D shooting, but it's a cool hobby lots of guys I hunt with enjoy off-season.
UsefulWalk4 4y ago
I'd say the hardest part is estimating range. Takes a lot of shooting at random targets to get your internal range finder down.
Two words: Tree Stand
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Where do you think I am right now?
25ft up a tree playing the wind.
They have noses, bro.
UsefulWalk4 4y ago
I figured. Just didn't want ManImproving to get the impression that you are tiptoeing around the woods hoping to bump into a buck inside of 50 yards. That's a pretty tough game to play.
ManImproving 4y ago
Thanks for the tip. I'm starting from zero on this. I haven't shot a bow since I was a kid, and nobody in my family hunts. I look forward to making all of the mistakes.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Find a local guy to help mentor you. We love spreading the knowledge we have for the next generation of hunters - especially ones that are eager and want to learn the tradition. It is a dying thing in today's world. Probaby too late this season, but look into hunting clubs in your area. Easiest way to find a mentor.
PM me if you have any questions.
Tyred_Biggums 4y ago
OYS
Age 37; 2 kids, separated. 102 days until final divorce can be applied for
Physical
I got my Crohn's all nice and under control, feel great at the moment. Energy levels back through the roof. Then I walked down some stairs and my achilles was excruciating and swelled up like a softball. Thought something was torn, but everything is in tact. A week later I'm able to
walkhobble on it without a brace. I did some research and talked to my brother who had similar issues. Found out based on my foot shape it may be the same issue - Haglund's deformity. Another challenge I may have beat.Mental
Mental is great. Even with the foot issues, I'm back to being calm. I find entertainment in petty shit at work - things breaking, people who were approve time off during critical times, etc. It's so meaningless and all these other fuckers get so stressed out about it.
Relationship
I've gotten some great feedback from johnny, Horns, Blarg, and others here. I'm just being me without getting caught up in any mental gymnastics of what I should or shouldn't be doing. My foot was absolutely killing me in the middle of the night last week, I got up and went to the couch to ice it and prop it up. Nurse came out and asked if she could help take care of me. Instead of shutting down - I let her put some NSAID cream on it, wrap it and you know what? It felt a lot better. I thanked her and she went back to bed.
I've been hanging out around her and her kids more (twin boys). I really enjoying having the change to do some 'boy things' that I've missed out on since my son died. I had a lot of conflicting feelings about this - guilt, feeling sad for not being able to do this with him. I liked how Horns put it to me: my son had given me a gift of his life, I can share my gifts if I choose with these kids. This context really has helped me in the past few weeks to be present and enjoy what I enjoy.
The relationship is now at 6 months and my kids have been asking to meet her for awhile. Our separation agreement lists 6 months as the timeframe for introductions. I stick to that. I do want to introduce Nurse to my kids. I do like this woman. I'm very cautious on this relationship and not letting feelingz get in the way of logic. Taking introductions to my kids and being around her very slow as that's what I see is best for them.
Housing and Life
STBX spent all the money she got from the divorce on a run down house in a terrible school district. Which on one hand is really really fucking funny. On the other, it means I need to live near where I'm at now. I've started to plan out housing as my lease is up at the start of 2021. Ideally I buy a new house in a similar area. I've reached out to my lender for how to spin alimony/CS on a mortgage. Looks like Fannie and Freddie changed guidelines recently that you can remove off income vs count as debt which would be awesome.
Career
I had the funding for the project I've been trying to get support for added to 2021 AOP. Big win here. It's the right thing for the company and I've been planting seeds for the past 2 years and watering them. It's paid off. I'll likely be on the steering committee for that one and the project I'm currently running while bringing in direct reports to run the day to day on them.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
Here's my off the cuff read and warning.
It seems like Nurse is really invested in you. SO invested that she's scared of losing you. That's good, in that it makes her very agreeable. But also means she will be doing things in the now that she won't be in the future when she feels like you're likely going to stay.
Just be ready for this pullback. And accept it for what it is...the pendulum swinging.
Tyred_Biggums 4y ago
Absolutely. She’s a woman. It’s expected.
aussie_darrow 4y ago
Ha! Every day I read these posts I always find a little gem. Thanks!
threekindsoflucky 4y ago
People appreciate the opportunity to add value.
BarracudaRP 4y ago
I remember in one of Tyred's recent posts, it was a struggle to let others help, even the nurse. I can relate, I bet a lot of guys can. Good on you for giving the gift of allowing others to help you, Ty. That's good shit.
ExactMammoth 4y ago
What do you attribute to such a dramatic turnaround on chrohns? Or does you condition often ebb and flow?
Tyred_Biggums 4y ago
It ebbs and flows. But I know how to manage a flare up it just took a really long time.
It appears a shit diet but it’s all food you can easily digest. Oatmeal, crackers, jello, soups. Low fiber, pedialyte and gatorade to stay hydrated.
The turning point was the colonoscopy since I had to be on a liquid diet for 24 hours. Since then everything improved daily. I also backed off the weights (didn’t stop just reduced volume) and stopped stressing my body.
That and rest - a fuck ton of rest. This is probably where I prolonged shit. Yes I got 7-8 hours but my body really needed much more to heal. I finally got that last week where I basically slept for nearly 2 days straight.
ExactMammoth 4y ago
That is interesting -
"Fasting-mimicking diet holds promise for treating people with inflammatory bowel disease"
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/03/190306171247.htm
Either way - glad you are back on the mend.
Tyred_Biggums 4y ago
Interesting. Pretty similar to what I did just looks like to use more prebiotics next time. Thanks for sharing.
ghost__walking 4y ago
Have you ever had kombucha? I had a pretty serious (undiagnosed) gut issue for about 10 years. IBS, food intolerances, hives, brain fog... it really sucked. It was very much like what Joe Cross described having in Fat, Sick, and Nearly Dead. I learned to manage triggers and pretty much gave up after doctors gave up. I'd spent many late nights researching my condition and believed I had a gut bacterial imbalance, but I didn't get anywhere with probiotic foods or supplements. I was offered a bottle of kombucha during a work lunch in 2018 and I noticed that afternoon that I was itching less. I drank a couple more bottles that week, and it completely cleared up the issues.
I think my condition was brought on by post-surgical antibiotics I took in 2008. That theory was solidified a bit when I took antibiotics for a sinus infection in 2018 and started getting hives on my stomach. I drank a couple of bottles of kombucha while I took the antibiotics and it made that stop again.
I'm not a doctor, but I hope this helps.
good_looking_man 4y ago
OYS # 1
5’11 @ 205 LBS, Mid-40’s. Married 21 Years.
BP: 190 LBS x 10, Squat: 225 LBS x 10, OHP: 120 LBS x 8, DL: 225 LBS x 10
Sidebar: MMSLP 2011, Rational Male Volumes 1-3, Practical Female Psychology, NMMNG, The Way of the Superior Man
Additional: Read most marriedRedPill and askMRP posts and comments. Watched all WhineMorePlease videos. Watch Rian Stone’s videos.
Introduction:
This is my first post. Found MRP about 4 months ago. I’m just going to lay it all out simply. I’m more or less a drunk captain. I have a sexy, and submissive wife who has always wanted me to step it up. She loves to have sex whenever I want it. She’s fun and naughty. So what’s the problem? It has nothing to do with her. The problem is me.
What is it about my life I don’t like?
I procrastinate and waste a lot of time.
I’m not good at being a handy man or home improvement.
There’s things I’d like to improve about my appearance. Skin, hair and six-pack.
I feel insecure socially.
I’m a dismissive avoidant.
I live in everyone else’s frame. All the time.
My mental models suck.
I have injuries from not lifting smart.
How do these things affect my life?
I procrastinate and waste a lot of time.
I don’t focus 100% at my work. Over the past year I’ve only worked at 50% capacity. If I can be successful with only 50% focus, I can’t imagine how successful I’d be with 100% effort. We have 2 clients and more on the way, yet I squander my time. I’m lucky that I’m really good at solving problems, because this is where I bring value to my company.
I also have a 2nd house on a lake that I bought as an investment around 1 1/2 ago. I had all these plans to fix it up and either use it as a vacation home or rent it out. It’s still sitting there costing me money each month, and bring me no benefit.
I let shit around the house to pile up in regards to home maintenance. This is what my wife is most frustrated with me about. Whenever she gets annoyed, it’s usually about my procrastination and not being handy. A long time ago I used to DEER, but I know this gets me nowhere because I too am bothered by my lack of following through.
I’m not good at being a handy man or home improvement.
I suck at being a handy man. I can’t fix shit. I know this is a beta quality, but when you lack the skill and know-how, it seems wives will deduct alpha points if you don’t have these beta skills. I need to learn, because I’m not a retard. I’m fully capable of figuring this shit out.
There’s things I’d like to improve about my appearance. Skin, hair and six-pack.
Even though I’m in my 40’s, my skin still breaks out.
I started losing my hair around 5 years ago. Luckily I’m halting and reversing my hair situation using Finasteride and Laser Therapy.
I like the way my body looks. I have a Chris Evan’s Captain America shape with a strong V taper and large shoulder to hip ratio. Despite not having the best lifts, it’s very apparent I lift by my body shape and muscle tone. The problem is all my weight goes to my naval area. I want to lose about 25 pounds so my abs pop out. I don't care about what my BF% is, I just want 6 abs to show.
I feel insecure socially.
I’ve always been socially shy when I’m not drinking. I’m a good looking guy. I’ve gotten attention from beautiful women my entire life. My wife is beautiful, and beautiful women in their 20’s have hit on me over the past year. Yet, my insides are not congruent with my outside.
I’m a dismissive avoidant.
I’ve learned to dismiss and avoid anyone who creates conflict or adversity in my life. At times this has included my wife. I’ve failed many comfort tests over the years and made her feel unappreciated and unloved.
I live in everyone else’s frame. All the time.
Even through I’m dismissive, I live in other people’s frame all the time. Maybe it’s my way of shutting these bad feelings off when I don’t want to feel bad feelings.
My mental models suck.
I built models in my head that I suck. Long story short, my dad was an alpha who took off left me with a cuck step-father who took shit out on me my entire childhood. I was the son of a Playboy photographer. Saw my first naked woman when I was 8. Saw my first cocain deal with I was 9. Overdosed on my father's marijuana brownies when I was 10. Thought it was a plate of brownies sitting out on the kitchen counter. Whatever my story was, no excuse for me to still be using these models.
I don’t take control of my finances
I allow my family household to go month to month without even a budget. As a result, we don’t have much saved even though I make $150,000 per year.
What is my mission?
I’ve been a successful workhorse my entire life. I make good money. All I want in life is to be happy in the moment with myself, my kids and my wife. I want to go to work for 8 hours and focus 100% when I’m there. When I’m home, I want to be present mentally with my children and my wife. I want to stop procrastinating and doing things that sabotage my happiness and quality of life.
This is all I want
What are my goals?
I’m giving myself 1 month for every year to un-fuck myself. So I’m rounding it up and giving myself 4 years (48 months) to un-fuck my mind and get my shit together.
This week was step 1 for me. My starting point is to first recognize everything I don’t like about my life and myself. Then learn to address these deficiencies in my mental models that’s causing it.
As far as lifting, I'm focusing more on form and increasing my reps between 8 and 12. My form suffers otherwise.
I'm going to have to depend on building new habits and commit to them.
My work begins this week. No more sitting on my ass and reading on the side lines.
SBIII 4y ago
Not much of an ask. What's stopping you?
good_looking_man 4y ago
What's stopping me is me and my excuses.
red-sfpplus 4y ago
I wanna see a video of you A2G squatting 225x10.
Otherwise STFU.
good_looking_man 4y ago
No thanks. I work in the physical therapy field. A2G vs parallel is debatable. As a man who's 47, I'll take the advice of 3 physical therapists I know and work with personally over some dude on the internet who takes gear.
https://www.advancedhumanperformance.com/atgparallelsquats
red-sfpplus 4y ago
I get it.
Learning and forming your own personal belief system is to much to ask for a faggot such as yourself.
Tell me, did you go into PT cause you couldn't hack it as an MD, or did you always aspire to be Gaylord Focker?
This place is perfect for you.
Week after week we will tell you what to do but you and your weak mind and soul will never do anything.
Because unlike your PT client who wanna recover from their injuries.
You are just a sad sack of a man whom cant squat A2G.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
There's so much shit wrong with your post but I'll take this time to pick on one thing:
Why is it a beta quality if you can't fix shit? Maybe your time is more valuable doing other other things and delegating that task to someone else so you can go do other things of greater value to YOUR LIFE and not worried about how your wife will "deduct alpha points"?
Or, you can choose to learn how to be handy because YOU WANT TO.
So deep in a woman's frame the first thing you think of is how since you can't fix something, she thinks you are a pussy, and that drives your mental model.
Don't be a retard.
good_looking_man 4y ago
I was too far up everyone else's frame to see it this way. Thank you.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
You're welcome.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
I'd caution OP to split your idea into it's relevant points I.E. to not learn to do something because of how it affects her and how to delegate tasks because it allows you to work on things that bring higher value....but it looks like OP already took it as an excuse to just not learn. Oh well.
good_looking_man 4y ago
I did understand HornsOfApathy's point straight away, but you're right I didn't empathize it. Whether I choose to learn to be handy or delegate these tasks should come from a place within my own frame, because it's what I want. Not because I'm trying to keep track of points with my wife.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
I don't want to change a radiator. I don't want to patch a roof. It's not about what you want. It's about using your time effectively. Pay for services, fine. But make sure you're using the time you gained to improve yourself more than the potential knowledge you just lost.
If you're paying to have your A.C. condenser fixed...you better damn well not be jacking off or lounging around during that time.
good_looking_man 4y ago
You're absolutely right. Especially the last sentence.
TranscendedCrow 4y ago
OYS #3
Age: 28 Height: 6’0 Weight: 215 Never Married & No kids
Mission: To dispel my delusions, renounce my weaknesses, and mold myself into a great man.
Currently Reading: True Style by Bruce Broyer
Yesterday was about six weeks from the motorcycle accident. Attempted some light strength training with poor results and adequate pain. Will have to stick to walking and stretching while I continue to heal. Diet has cleaned up but it’s not quite where it could be. I was doing great with calories until the potluck at work in which I binged hard. I am noticing a drop in food discipline as “if it doesn’t count” while at work. This is something that I will be more aware of going forward. I have no problem with my healthy pre-packed meals but once other food is offered it’s a free for all.
Speaking of work. I signed up for an opportunity to go on a work/humanitarian mission in the United States for two months. I wouldn’t deploy for another three weeks. Hopefully I am healed up enough by then. It was too much of an opportunity to say no; recovering from trauma or not.
So while I was getting clearance from my physicians for this deployment I learned some bad news. My optometrist signed off on me going but said I would be high risk doing any martial art and she would recommend I never even dabble in such sports. Apparently my Commotio Retinae could trigger blindness if I took one unlucky shot right to the face. She says this eye vulnerability will follow me the rest of my life.
I am quite devastated by this news. As I have mentioned in previous OYS’s getting involved in a martial art has been a life dream for me; being a rural farm kid it was never an opportunity while young. Aside from that what about my other hobbies? Getting on a motorcycle ever again? Scuba diving? Flying spent brass on a firing range? I have a lot of active high risk things I like to do and now I have to be ultra-conscious of this forever!?
She is quite a young and new optometrist and I will be getting second opinions and a hopefully more accurate risk assessment. I would hate to give up so many things I love if the risk of severe eye damage is so little. This has been taking up the most space in my mind.
Nothing really new on the relationship front since my action packed triple strike out last week. Horns recommended I re-read models which I agreed is a good idea. Not too motivated now though, because I have to prep for a possible two month deployment. I have to focus on recovery, my health, and review and train my EMT/Medical skills.
Bigfootinmouth 4y ago
OYS #20
Stats: age mid 30, married to wife (mid 30), 3 kids (under 10y). Height 5,9". Weight 75 kg. Doing Strong lift 5x5 at B 62,5 kg, OHP 55 kg, DL 120 kg, SQ 115 kg + 5, ROW 62,5 kg, Fsq 70 kg
Reading: Watching Rian Stones sidebar material on YT, TWOSM, Way of men
Training/Body
Gym three times. Struggling some with motivation, with some exercises and with feeling weak generally. Might be a cold or lack of sleep. I will better refrain from eating shit. I have fallen back into rewarding myself with treats which is just stupid.
Sex
Almost every night for the last week (ovulation). Not very high quality but I am building momentum with the DEVI concepts and don't think going from 0 to 100 is a good idea. I am not super into fucking every night, especially when variaty is poor (working on that). I am fucking up when acting too safe and not risking getting a no. I will introduce my interests more in a strategic manner (SGM) as the momentum grows.
Mental
Monitoring myself during this period of lots of sex to guard against back slide in frame. Been getting plenty of tests. Mostly compliance tests. My strategy is to not be autistic in my reaction to them. Since I don't really care if sex is happening OI is solid (at least right now). Declined sex yesterday when she was acting like an entitled child.
Short term goals:
Lift 1.5 times BW B, SQ and DL.
Long term goals:
Be a confident man with a powerful mind and body which are useful tools for shaping my life and influence my society.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
For some reason I think your idea of going 0 to 100 is something like making her blow you (0) to cumming on her face (100). Your idea of what "100" is more than likely is pretty fucking tame.
Because you're boring.
Because you've hamstered that your "100" is too much. Do whatever it is that YOU want to do. Your fear of getting a "no" is likely unfounded and is an imaginary boundary that you're projecting on your woman because of your own fear.
This statement is entirely bullshit and incongruent to what you wrote an entire OYS about. I can think of one way you aren't confident now. When was the last time you fucked your woman?
Bigfootinmouth 4y ago
Dont blame you.
Thankfully thats 0.
Yes, though my 100 is more like yours so that would be Rambo. But I ageee I am playing it too safe.
Read that post many times together with WOTSM and SGM. I am working on it albeit base level. Going from no D at all.
MonkModeActive 4y ago
2020-09-22 This is my fifteen OYS
Mindset
Spent some time away from social media including facebook, instagram and reddit for the last couple of weeks.
Reading TWOTSM for OYS and The Practice of the Wild because I think it is helping to clarify my thinking on my mission.
Mould
Into the gym and have started Stronglifts 5x5 Mon/Wed/Fri. BW 94kg DL 85 SQ 52.5 BP 42.5 BBR 52.5 OHP 30. The immediate goal is to be lifting moderately heavy by December which I think is achievable following the intermediate plan.
Rowing machine 2x 4km/16min Mon/Wed and 7km/30min Sat.
Otherwise I have been sticking to my 2400 calorie/day meal plan.
Man
Keeping my journal writing limited to my mission rather than obsessing on my sexual fantasies, which was rather gay of me. I used a life wheel template to work out what is important to me and put a timeline together of the family over the next two decades. From this I have worked out three planning horizons with key activities against these. I think CV19 has hastened the trend of decentralisation, for example by making working from home more common, and I’d like to make use of that to further my mission.
Money
Last week I interviewed for a more senior role in my current organisation that has a national focus. My role is currently the regional lead so this would be a step up. Had good rapport with the two executives. Updated my 20-21 business plan and engaged with the regional executive team to get sign-off. I don’t think I’m in the right company for my market, so have kept my resume up to date and continue to apply for attractive roles.
Marriage
Wife is dealing with a bout of depression which has been getting worse and professionals are involved. I’ve read the posts about this being all my fault. I’m keeping the home environment on an even keel, the day to day with the kids is okay, and I’m not writing any covert contracts (I think). Shit tests have been minor and I think dealt with okay. If I reflect on Dread Levels I’m working my way through level four. Initiating and being playful but only modest success, which was driving me a little crazy. I don’t think I acted out on this overtly but did find myself looking for trouble in other areas which was part validation seeking. I revisited NMMNG caring versus caretaking and am content that I’ve got this balance right for now.
ImpatientZen 4y ago
The amount of improvement you would get from doubling down on diet and exercise cannot be overstated. The mental effect is enormous I find.
I would focus on this. It is the easy stuff, 100% predictable results from your efforts.
How tall are you and how much weight have you lost over the last 4 weeks?
MonkModeActive 4y ago
Thanks u/impatientzen, that is a good point. I (finally) started lifting 5x5 to move in this direction. Weight-wise, I haven't moved anywhere though.
At 180cm my TDEE goal is 92kg at 15% BF. My lifting goals by December are BP 92 SQ 185 DL 235 which I think is achievable. I've been weighing my portions and everything so maybe I'll need to cut the intake more. I was going to see where I was at after four weeks on 5x5.
ImpatientZen 4y ago
I figured. Get this fixed. There is really no excuse. Lose 1lb by next OYS.
And forget about goals. Do a good compound programme with progressive overload and add weight each workout until december and see where you are. I prefer SS or GSLP to 5x5, but whatever works. Don't wimp out, add weight each workout as programmed.
Do the same for BW. Lose 3-4lbs per month until december then reassess.
FWIW I am an inch taller than you and some years back I was around your "92kg" with 300bp/400sq/500dl. I was still a tiny bit fluffy, maybe 16-17% BF. 180cm 92kg 15% BF thus means you are deadlifting 500+. That's gonna take a while. The sad truth is that with average genetics and without gear it can be hard to carry much more than 2,5lbs BW/inch of height without being fat.
So you have quite a way to go. Good news is noob gains are awesome and super easy. Get after it.
ExactMammoth 4y ago
OYS 21 -
35 yo, 6'2, 206lbs (IF cutting - Down 9lbs), 20% bodyfat, Married 8 years, together 13, 2 kids (2.5 and newborn)
Lifts: SQ - 315 x5, PR - 137.5 x5, BP - 235 x3, DL - 335 x5
Work - Still working long hours and very busy.
This is the shit I need to own this week - I am still not setting and enforcing boundaries at work - I have 2 client restructure conversations that need to happen - one I have been putting off (the guy is fired, he just doesn't know it), the other I keep telling the client what needs to happen and they don't respond. I need to come in with consequences or nothing will happen.
I wanted to have the conversations before I wrote this so I wouldn't have to even talk about it, but here I am. Bottom line - I will make the calls today get it done.
Relationship - going well here. Her brain seems to be getting better over time w postpartum stuff. I have been pretty focused w work and kids, and my DNGAF is real. I have been STFU and not validation seeking pretty well.
I also have found a new path to initiating that isn't orbit, indirect, have no needs nice guy shit. The other night I said let's go up and have sex. She said she didn't want to and I joked that I didn't either, but it was going to happen. We went up and had sex. The words don't matter.
Myself - I have noticed several times how good I am feeling and how peaceful my mind is. I was driving the other day in the car with my toddler and just noticed that nothing is bothering me, and that I am not carrying mental tension. Nothing really needed to be done and everything was in order in the moment.
I can still jump to shit that needs to get done (fix work problems, clean garage, email, etc.) but I have a mental space that is different and better than it was a couple of months ago (thank you u/blarg_risen and u/Tyred_Biggums)
I haven't needed to "blow off steam" w junk food, porn etc. I want to further curb my screentime and relax a bit more in my downtime. I still need to finish MMSLP - it has been to long to not have that one knocked out.
Shit going well - no porn, fasting and seeing results, haven't missed a lift, feeling actual dngaf at home, clear mental space.
Shit not going well - work boundaries and incongruence. This is my #1 priority this week.
dust2dust45 4y ago
OYS #5 35, 8yrs married. 3kids under 6, weight 171 (-1), 6ft, bf% ~16. All 5x5: bench: 155, squat: 205, dead: 215, ohp: 105.
I haven’t played video games 10+ years, no smoking, no whining/complaining, no DEER.
Goal: 180lbs, not keeping up with the calorie needs to get there, but I continue to try and track. My motivation to gain weight is a general self challenge and belief and experience of hitting my goals. I want to be stronger to support long term health and attractiveness.
Mindset issues: Validation, victim, lazy, fun Validation: feeling a lot better here as my fantasizing/anticipation/thirst for sex is nearly 0. Victim: recognizing thoughts / feelings and rejecting them Lazy: pretty fucking lazy Fun: not fun enough, need more social opps.
Relationship: worst sex that I can remember in years. I had been kino and suggesting for later during the day, but she worked late and was tired and before heading to bed even said no worries for another night and she said it’s fine and I know you’d like it. While rubbing her back she even started talking about contractor bids! The most starfish experience ever. I need to walk away next time.
2 days later I started to get butthurt. I was feeling in the mood during the day but she didn’t give a hug/kiss during the day , nor did I. So I started reducing my attention/ignoring her during dinner and evening, and once kids were asleep went to store so things I needed. I usually never leave the house at night and I need to do it more. Upon return she started anxious talk of kids, and I basically ignored her and didn’t make eye contact. She asked a couple times if anything was wrong and I said no and she went to sleep early.
She revealed my errors by asking if something wrong.
I want to lead her into a great relationship, but I feel like I’m pulling her along and she doesn’t prioritize me or care and all her focus is on kids.
HornsOfApathy 4y ago
Rule 9.
man_in_the_world 4y ago
Your wife was tired yet willing to do it for you; in this situation it's on you to decisively take charge and make it short and sweet or to caveman, or to decisively postpone.
But instead of injecting the high energy and activity needed to engage her in this circumstance, or to bring yourself pleasure, you initiate a low-energy backrub and wait for her to get aroused and for her to take charge of providing the sexual energy.
After this indecisive faggotry on your part, why are you the least bit surprised or offended that her exhausted mind didn't change to high sexual gear? Either do the long, slow backrub and easy conversation about her day to let her mind wind down and slowly wind up again for easy, relaxed sex, or bring the high-energy whirlwind of your desire and sweep her up in it. She acted exactly in accordance with your sexual signals. The problem was that your ego was too timid to risk decisively initiating the sex you wanted, and too needy and fragile to forgo a validation of an immediate sexual response.
Wrong. You need to take charge, bring the sexual energy yourself, and decisively lead her through the sex you want, instead of making her lead then getting butthurt for days that she didn't read your covert mind. Let go of this passive, entitled victim, Nice Guy mindset.
AlphalfaSprout 4y ago
Some of the best stuff is always in responses to OYS. I love this place because threads like this, Guy A helping Guy B own his shit, can make a lightbulb go off in Guy C’s head.
UsuallyUseMy_Name 4y ago
OYS #2
31, 6’2” 188 lbs Married 5, together 11, no kids. Squat 150x5 DL 175x5 Bench 75x5 OHP 62.5x5
Read: NMMNG (x2), MMSLP, MAP, Pook
Reading: Sidebar, WISNIFG
WORK: I’m grinding on my new business, and it’s going well. I’m still probably about 2 weeks out form acquiring clients, and this feeling that ‘I can handle whatever happens’ is new. I’m in a place of pressure and change, but I feel excited and good. A year ago I would have felt that I needed to include my wife in any business venture, that I needed permission, but now I see that this is something I am creating- it doesn’t have anything to do with her. I haven’t been asking for her opinion, looking for validation they way I once would have, I’m just doing. I put the money down for the things I needed to get started and started. I didn’t have endless conversations where I puked out me feelz to her trying to get approval. I made a decision and I’m following through.
I’m working with a business partner, and we obviously are different people and we see and do things differently. I know this guy very well and I know he can produce, and his track record at his current job is impeccable. He isn’t working in the same way I would, and I’m using this as practice for taking ownership of my life and role in everything. I would have usually resorted to puking my feelz when things weren’t happening the way I wanted. Instead, this past week I’ve been noticing when I have that impulse and instead being clear about what I want and why and being open to being argued to another position, should he have good information or a better idea. I’m setting clear expectations instead of trying to ‘maneuver’ him into do what I want.
MARRIAGE/SEX: I’m still learning how to handle all this stuff. I fall back into using my wife as a measure of my life. I spent so much time in her frame that I have to stay conscious of how I make decisions. My understanding of MRP is still developing. I’ve read most of the sidebar and a few of the books, but I haven't internalized it all yet. Pook talks about ’techniques’ being a crutch- and I think I see that here as well. It’s about becoming a man, not saying ‘xyz’ to get your wife to blow you. It seems like the sex is a side effect. I still am operating in her frame. I can see the first step is taking an active role in a hobby alone and connecting with male friends.
I haven’t been acting it out as aggressively, but I still feel like a petulant child when my wife doesn’t respond as well sexually as I’d imagined she would. I still get quiet and it takes me maybe 5-10 ten minutes to recover. That’s better than acting like a child the entire night, but it isn’t good enough. I do two things I can see clearly that cause this, so I’m going to start there. The first is using covert contracts. I’m getting playful/physical, but not in a grab her and take her to the bedroom way or not asking explicitly for what I want. I’m using a covert contract along the lines of ‘if I show physical affection enough she’ll escalate to sex every so often.’ I’m the man, and it’s my job to lead the interaction. The second is related- I have been so afraid of out right rejection from her that I don't become explicit in my desire (whether verbal or by physically escalation things myself). I need to let go of using whether she says yes or no to sex be the deciding factor in my behavior, mood, and life.
PSYCHOLOGICAL: Reading WISNIFG is eye opening. I’m constantly telling small lies to manage how other people see me- I’m letting them decide how I should behave and lying like a child caught with his hand in the cookie jar to manage other peoples emotions and opinions of me. I have spent a lifetime afraid of other people removing their ‘goodwill’ from me, and it’s keeping me stuck living a life in everyone else’s frame but mine. I don’t believe intellectually that the most important thing is that other people aren’t upset, but I certainly behave as if that is my core value. Actions speak louder than words, which means my core value up until now has been ‘do whatever is necessary to ensure others don’t feel negative emotions, especially about me.’ That needs to change immediately.
I still don’t really understand frame in a deep way, it’s something I’m working on learning and discovering, but I can see that I don’t really have it yet. This related back to the previous section, but when I am spending time with my wife doing things, I don’t have a strong opinion about what I want to do. I’ve been creating a plan and executing it, but it isn’t because I want to, it’s because I think it will be fun enough and entertain her. This isn’t the right way to go about choosing what to do. I should be making choices because it’s what I want to do and bring her along.
In my head I make the excuse of ’not having enough money’ because I’m starting the new business and (basically) lost the old one etc. But, this is an excuse, first I have enough to spend a few bucks renting a jet ski or at the range or to go rock climbing or whatever else I feel like doing. I’m just being cheap. And even if I really get to where I’m that tight for cash I can pick a hike I’m excited about or find a lake to go swim in or invite some friends over to cook for, because I want to.
PHYSICAL: I’ve done all my strong lifts workouts so far.. It’s less work than usual, and because I cut back on weight and reps it hasn’t been crazy hard, but everyday more weight goes on the bar. I’m excited to be grinding them out again. I’ll be there soon enough. Food wise I’ve been eating everything I want to, but I keep skipping meals because I’m being cheap and I haven’t been gaining. I need to be more disciplined about eating lunch these next few weeks.
[deleted] 4y ago
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UsuallyUseMy_Name 4y ago
I’m having a hard time answering this question clearly- which is probably the problem you’re pointing out.
Setting targets at the current gig is so I don’t slack off there while I build the new business. Building the new business is to gain more control over my life and finances, doing something I’m good at and enjoy. PMO leads to depression for me, spending 2 hours a day watching porn was what started my slide into beta-dom and where I got off track to begin with. The other stuff is to start break myself out of living in her frame. Instead of taking everything she says as seriously I’m going to AA and STFU so that I’m having more fun instead of just waiting to be alone.
[deleted] 4y ago
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UsuallyUseMy_Name 4y ago
I hear you there.
I had one relapse a little bit ago. Otherwise, I'm 88 days into no PMO. I have that there as a goal, because the one time I relapsed it was because I thought I'd been so long without a craving I didn't need to worry about it. Stupid.
I'm starting some of those other goals as next steps. I'm not watching porn, so now what? That's what I'm figuring out.
TheActionNerd 4y ago
OYS 39
30y, height: 186cm, waist: 81cm, neck: 38cm, 82.2kg, navy: 12%. wife 26 married 2 years, together 6 years. 0 kids.
Lifts (GZCLP): Squat: 100kg 3x5, DL: 110kg 3x5, BP: 65kg 2x6, OHP: 47.5kg 3x5*
Background
Believed that all I would want from life is to find a wife and have a family. Everything I had done before RP was to find someone to love me and to prove myself to others. Since I have found RP, no longer believe that having children is my priority and that I had wanted them for the wrong reasons. I am currently grinding within a marriage to reach an abundance and outcome independence mindset. I want to live a life of financial, physical and mental freedom and I expect to eventually need to kill the puppy.
Mission - Cut out the bullshit and bring more truth to the world.
Readings:
MMSLP, NMMNG, TWOTSM, Pook, Rational Male, Preventive Medicine, How to Win Friends and Influence People, Models, The Subtle Art of Not Giving a Fuck, Art of Seduction, WISNIFG, Day Bang, Mastery, Mindful Attraction Plan, The Charisma Myth, Extreme Ownership, The Power of Habit, 6 Pillars of Self-Esteem, The Power of Now, Sex God Method, The Way of Men
Currently reading: Never Split the Difference
Physical
5/7 20 minute meditation
4/7 Get into bed before 1am.
I am doing marginally better on meditation and sleeping earlier but no excuse for me to not just nail the 7/7 if I really want it. Failed the on OHP at 47.5 so moving to 6x2. Really enjoying the GZCLP program and happy that the solution for failure is different from SL5x5. Feeling like I’m close to failure on squat and deadlift as well but I think that is part mental as I am now setting new PBs for both. Back to eating 4 meals a day instead of intermittent fasting.
Finance/Career
Since getting back from holiday, I have been sluggish getting back into work and my own tasks. There’s been a little bit of this for a while and I think it’s fatigue from working from home. I’ve just been focusing on being a resource for members of my team and I field a lot of questions from my team every day. I just need to stop being lazy and complete my own tasks.
Mental
I am feeling sluggish in terms of owning my shit but also feeling good about my available tools for shit tests. I’ve been enjoying Never Split the Difference and it’s given me a few extra tools to use in shit tests, some in line with RP lessons such as mirroring (repeat) and silence (STFU). There’s a few other useful tools in there as well but I’m still calibrating how to apply them as some could be too supplicating for my liking. WISNIFG was hard for me to understand and I was ineffective at fogging. Using some of these new tools, I’m actually also able to incorporate some fogging into my responses during shit tests.
I organised a social event with my friends in Aus playing video games, It’s a game I really want to play so I decided to just take ownership and organise the 10 people required to play. It is still an unhealthy use of time and I can justify playing the game with friends, but I’m also wasting time watching strangers play the game on twitch.
I met up with my BP friend who just started a long distance relationship with his gf 13 hours flight away. It gets me out of the house and I feel fully confident with him so it’s a good opportunity to reinforce my principles and beliefs. Didn’t try to save him and just told him to focus on lifting while in his LDR. Played disc golf with him and will go to a driving range with him again in 2 weeks before my next roadtrip.
SBIII 4y ago
What does that even mean? It sounds like total bullshit.
RStonePT 4y ago
What a fucking bullshit set of vague fuckaroundable goals these are.
Seriously dude, is this your plan? What exactly does an end state look like for you? Define abundance for me. See if we can do outcome independence while we are at it. I know what the terms mean, but I have a feeling you don't.
Why are they numbered? Are you writing a book? Is there some reason? Are you expecting X amount of weeks to achieve a goal? I'm guessing you saw someone else doing it and figured you should do it too, amirite? You're focused so much on the details involved with fitting in: saying the pithy terms we use, showing off how you've invested 40 weeks ... Are you looking to sort some shit out or are you looking to join some edgy internet clubhouse with secret handshakes and language the normies don't understand?
No one cares, everyone has their errant models and life scripts, after 39 weeks I assume you'd have gotten past your Batman Origin Story. I get it, both your parents were killed by the joker, move the fuck on already.
Navel Gazing is not red pilled. Putting a pin into your 'priority' bit
What does grinding mean? I'm half way through this and haven't seen anything that isn't a fart in the wind Mr. Wayne.
I know just where you can start ...
Most of these books aren't one the sidebar, so why did you add them? No one cares if you're well read, or have a library with leather bound books that smell of scotch and masturbation cream, why what purpose is this in your report? The reason people add sidebar books is so the guys pinging ideas off you can have some idea what you should know, or don't know yet. This is a tool for others to better craft responses to the work that you've already done. This is not here to have you jerk yourself off about wordcounts Mr. Wayne
Why? Why are you reading this. What skill do you lack you can learn from this book? Do you know or did you pick up some (top 100 books for masculine alpha men every patriarch should read?)
This isn't physical.
Sitting in a room breathing is the perfect example of everything wrong with this post BTW.
Future tense? Past tense? Have you gone to the bedroom at midnight? Did you fall asleep? Why are you avoiding any singe detail that could provide the slightest bit of insight into whether you are getting closer to the only tangeable goal you've provided so far? I won't even ask why the 1AM is anything more than an arbitrary time you picked out of the air.
This screams "catholic confession." You didn't increase an overhead lift, so you say you failed, expect the priest to forgive you and give you a penance (write it down in OWS and give 2 rosaries Mr. Wayne). I bolded the part where you flat out lied to yourself. How much were you fasting? How many calories in 4 meals? I expect you didn't put that in because that could be construed as an actual metric and others could possibly let you know is a good/bad idea. No no, keep it vague and fungable, so no matter what you do, you'll recieve the OYS forgiveness prayer and feel good about whatever participation trophy you gave yourself.
How do you plan to do this. Better yet, what have you already done to accomplish this goal? Why did you even bother to write down you didn't feel like working and so you didn't work ... but next time I will do better.
Amen.
...
RStonePT 4y ago
Who gives a shit how you feel? Why do you care, because the only feelings I've seen you express are confusion, lethargy and regret. Fuck your feelings, they all suck and you suck too. You'd know that if there was concrete numbers and accomplishments attached to any of this.
Negotiating desire? Have we learned nothing thus far from that wide selection of books you are so proud of? Shit tests are a girl who thinks any alpha she detected is a false signal so she throws out some cunty behaviour to test you. The fact you are negotiating means you fucked it up already. You would know that if you did more than skim WISNIFG or MMSLP so you could add more books to your participation trophy. Go back and read it again, if it's really that tough I'm literally going chapter by chapter through this in my youtube sidebar series...
I forgot to ask, with all this focus on shit tests, are you fucking more?
Since I'm streaming on Twitch far from me to tell you not to watch that shit, but you used the word 'justify' when you should have used 'rationalize' as they aren't the same thing. Justification means you've weighed the pros and cons and the former outweighs the latter. Rationalize means you did what you wanted to do and came up with a post hoc story to convince yourself you're not fucking around.
"reinforce my principles and beliefs" What beliefs or principles? You fuck around at work, you fuck around setting goals, you skim books and don't ingest the content of them, then convince yourself you're still cool while asking for forgiveness for your sins in a weird roundabout way. If you were red pilled you'd already know there is no such thing as an LDR, and your buddy is getting taken advantage of.
if this was alcohol and not your simp friend people would have called you an alcoholic. Think about that.
The only smart thing you've said in this post so I'm inclined to think it was an accident.
Look, this isn't a post, you're not owning your shit, you are barely addressing your shit. Stop trying to convince yourself how smart, well read you are. You don't have potential, you ain't shit. Your actions speak to you being 'aint shit. And you know what?
Thats OK.
You ain't shit, your goals are vague and fungable, you aren't holding yourself to account, and youre continuing to rationalize your medicrity unde the guise of friendship. You made it a point to tell the reader how much shittier your friend is than you, which is what chicks do ... They watch Jerry Springer so they can watch trailer trash act like trailer trash so they can feel better about their less trailer trashy life.
You're not a chick, act accordingly.
My advice, and take it or leave it, is that you're aimless, most guys are and thats fine. Promise yourself that you'll make the you next year into a guy who can make hard choices, and get to work getting there.
And make the goals specific. Are you fat? How fat? 20 pounds? Well, thats 20 pounds x 3500 calories. Your meal plan now has a number to cut from your fucking food. Want a drink on your 'mostly sober' weeks? fuck you, 70 000 calories cut, then you can have a drink. Didn't lose a pound this week? Well look at your diet and activity and decide on a way to burn more calories or consume less. Post it here, then someone may actually be able to point you in a good direction.
Is your wife not fucking you? Go be fuckable. Fuckable guys have game. Have you talked to any girls? Have you approached? Have you had 5 girls laugh at your jokes and smile at you before you got home? Did that change how you deal with your wife (or not deal with her?)If you have to leave, did you plan any administration? Seen a lawyer? Developed a plan? (Red Curious has a beta male divorce guide, read it) if you fail something, did you make a decision on what has to change to meet the goal? Cause it's either your expectations (which if you were specific in your OYS goals someone can mention that it's not realistic) your plan is shit, or your execution needs work.
Either way, I knew I would waste my time the minute I hit the 'reply' button. You either need to come to terms with when you decided to waste your time, or get busy not wasting your time.
TheActionNerd 4y ago
Thanks Rian. I appreciate the time you've taken to give me such an in-depth breakdown. A lot of hitting the nail on the head with my bullshit. Some points I can still justify/rationalise to myself so I may need further calling out for that. I won't presume to waste more of your time.
For my own benefit, I'll be writing a response to these points to internalise them and setting actionable goals where I can.
threekindsoflucky 4y ago
Two comments? I didn't realise J10H was your main account and stoney is the smurf. Honestly though this is great. I mean, you wasted your time, but it applies to more than just this guy.
Cloudy_Pirate 4y ago
Rian' is just salty that Fuccfiles isn't listed in the extensive library below.
​
Readings:
RStonePT 4y ago
The point is to get him thinking. The two answer I'll see if he's a lost cause are
Lash out or
Ideally, I'd like if he just quietly updated his goals and got back to work, but I have a feeling he won't.
threekindsoflucky 4y ago
You'll probably get a username mention in his next post.
RStonePT 4y ago
Of course. Why would someone not assume I'm invested in them?
capn_barnacles 4y ago
OYS – 9/22/2020 51 years old. 5’10”, 175 lbs, 17.5% BF. Lifts: BP=165 x 5, DL (trap bar)=305 x 5, SQ 225 x 5. M-13 years, kids 8, 8, 5.
The Bad
I’ve been way too tolerant regarding intolerant behavior directed towards me. Calling it out more than I used to, but I’m still I’m still enforcing any sort of real boundary, and absorbing way too much of the attacks on me. Also taking the behavior to personally, getting too butt-hurt and giving it more weight than it deserves.
Been in my head a little too much. Based on recent behavior, I’m feeling the urge to end things. But I struggle with the dilemma on whether:
a. That’s just taking the easy way out, and it shows that I really haven’t done the work to improve myself and my attractiveness in any meaningful way, or
b. I did a terrible job of vetting in the beginning (daddy issues), and I just need to correct that now and move on with my new life with just me and my kids.
The Good
Thinking through life on my own has felt good. Looking at housing options if it came to that. I think I could still find a decent place to live at an affordable price in my area. Big enough for me and the kids.
BF% continues to come down, hitting a new all-time low last week. Diet has been reasonably solid, and little to no alcohol in the last few weeks has felt great.
With thoughts around potential divorce, I’ve been investing more quality time with the kids. Also thinking through all of the bullshit they wouldn’t witness post-divorce, makes me think they would be okay in the long run.
Goals for the Week
Work towards not absorbing the BS thrown my way. Don’t get too hung up on whether it’s a shit test or just general disrespectful behavior. Call it out, AM, AA, do something different.
Look into fall/winter social activities to do outside of the house.
2wo2wo3hree 4y ago
-Yeah, don’t get hung up on them but make an effort to identify each and act accordingly. Otherwise, you’ll treat them the same and step on your dick each time. Better to master them.
a.
b.
c. You’re so deeply stuck in your wife’s frame that your only solution to have your own frame is to literally pack your bags, run away and go somewhere else. The minute you find a new woman, you’ll slip right into betadom because instead of the alpha-up solution, you’re escaping and taking your beta self to another woman. Go face yourself, then face your wife, Close your mouth, win through actions, STFU, sidebar, lift, pass shit tests, pass comfort tests, game, kino, be attractive, don’t be unattractive.
capn_barnacles 4y ago
Thank you, well said.
lionsarebigkittens 4y ago
OYS #2:
Stats: 35y, 5'8", fit, never married, no kids
Basics (/10): Social 6, leading 5, hygiene 7, family 4, diet 7, training 8, discipline 5. No porn, no videogames – ok; masturbation – once ("healthy" as below, not sure if bullshit)
General
Did a lot of things I've been avoiding for weeks/months, but still avoiding other things. Finished NMMNG and worked on addressing "toxic shame" and inadequacy beliefs. I'm working on having a frame where it's good to be openly sexual, trying to address shame/fears/beliefs. A conflict here. Supposedly, "healthy masturbation" (no porn, no fantasies, no ejaculation, not compulsive, not as avoidance) can make it easier to not dislike myself for being sexual. I did it once, it was beneficial as described, but feels like bullshit, too. Can't tell if it was more beneficial or bullshitty.
Discipline is improved but still could be so much better. The things I decide to do, for the most part I do more easily. But I jumbled the daily routine/meditation/habit tracking. The to-do list was useful, even though I aimed way too high, again. Took me over a week to do the tasks I had planned for one day (and I dropped some, too). With perfect discipline I could have probably finished them in 2-3 days. Need to aim lower and hit the target so I can actually feel good about it. Then add more stuff.
Physical
Went running on most days but skipped some – I kept thinking "later" and skipped it. I realise as I'm writing this, "later" means "now, you scared fuck"+fail. Did the 100x pushups every day, up to 45, 45, 10. Moved to the 40kg kettlebell and injured my arm. Stupid. I used to be fine with it before, but I'm too weak now. Need a few days rest from heavy kettlebells and then building higher volume before trying again.
Game/sex
Looking for something long term. Decided to try an app. I used to consider them pointless and "unfair". Silly. Made a slightly more forward profile. A date is on the calendar, will see if it happens. Being my type of humorous ended two out of three conversations, but I like it, so I'm keeping that. Just needs practice. Every chat feels like a learning experience instead of "a hope". Them leaving only makes me more motivated to improve, instead of feeling bad/annoyed, like I used to do.
Social
Met more friends this week (3), was a bit more proactive, went to a social event and signed up for another one. Also, scheduled a date. Much better than before, could be a lot better still.
Family
Spoke with my brother and my father but only very quickly. Probably still running away from it because of the question "looking for jobs"?
Work
Stupid fear, looking for a job. Feels something like the "memory fear" from NMMNG. Not exactly, but I've avoiding it for months. All I wanted to do this week was find my cv. I only did that while writing this (took just 10 minutes to dig out the archive drive and find it), as I'd have to write that I'd failed even that. Just this for so many days. Laughable, but better than the last few months. Goal for next week – go through courses the I've finished to remember stuff, do my cv to it's best shape for this week, make a public portfolio (regardless of how bad) and post anything there, apply to two crappy jobs, just to get rid of the weird fear. I'm skipping one of the biggest issues – what kind of job exactly to look for. I need to figure that out, too.
Mission
I light up for all kinds of ideas/goals, which look to me pointless or laughable some time later. Too big - starts feeling like fantasy; anything smaller - starts feeling pointless. Maybe it's just the effect of lack of long term success.
Feedback is welcome, especially calling out bullshit I'm missing.
ghost__walking 4y ago
Don't aim lower for easy wins, especially when you said that you could have knocked shit out in 2-3 days. You won't be proud of yourself for clearing a low bar and then having a celebratory jackoff session. I see a lot of "I need to" and rationalizing why you didn't. Make a daily task list, and don't reward yourself until the shit you plan to do is done. Develop and stick with a routine. Days are fucking long. My 11 year old works harder than you.
No, but I found my CV this week!
IMO, don't even date right now. You have a lot of work to do if you want to be datable. As soon as the topic of job/career comes up, your date is going to shut down hard, and that's going to destroy your fragile ego.
Good luck.
lionsarebigkittens 4y ago
Thank you.
I generally agree about targets. I do need some small wins to reduce the self-hate, but should aim for realistic, not easy.
As for the dating, I don't want to avoid it. My fragile ego will need to handle it. I don't want to avoid women to the point where I'm scared to even swipe on an app, like I've done with the job search.
Tyred_Biggums 4y ago
If you think may be bullshit - then it's bullshit.
Go in without expectation. Long term, short term, whatever. Just be yourself, no expectations. Hell - I had no intention to get into an LTR and actually fought it for awhile. But it is what it is. If I shed my ego, shed my expectations - I'm happy. It may crash and burn, it may not. Whatever, I'm good either way.
Goal should be to move off OLD app to text, get logistics setup, and a date.
What does "better" look like?
lionsarebigkittens 4y ago
For the masturbation bullshit - I agree. It was a convenient rationalization with minor benefit I could have achieved in other ways/could have gone without. "The books says it's fine, so it must be fine."
For the app, I let my humor loose (me funny) in the first message, second message, etc. If her humor doesn't match mine, she leaves, I've saved myself time. I suggest a meeting at around 4-5 messages. I think I have the goal you describe, though I don't care about moving off the app
"Better"... meeting new people weekly, building connections with some of the new people do discuss interests (drawing, work, technology). Thanks for pointing that out, I had joined one general group, but I've just joined another one for work.
Blarg_Risen 4y ago
I'm about to get deeper into this myself so this is more of me showing a path than pointing enthusiastically down it. I am going to start asking myself before doing things: "Is this caring for myself? Or is this hurting myself?
Because there are times I'll do things out of boredom. And afterwards I know I knew beforehand they were bad for me. Other times I can do those same things completely hedonistically...and feel great after. And I knew for those beforehand those things were good for me. So the important question is, is doing those things caring for yourself and treating yourself right? Or abusing yourself and treating yourself poorly. You already know the answer. You just need to hold yourself accountable to it.
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lionsarebigkittens 4y ago
Thank you for pointing that out, I wasn't. I've just literally added that description to my profile. I was keeping the door open for short term as well. Lame, dancing around the fact. Actually, what I'm looking for right now is more general contact with women, or "practice", if you want. I hope for a great match for a family, but I don't expect it, and I wouldn't go for long term with anything less.
Not sure if I'm wasting my time this way. I'm most likely wasting some of theirs but I can live with that, thinking that I'm giving them some good time.
I need to fix myself before I'm attractive enough for somebody I find very attractive, but I don't want to avoid women in the meantime. Avoiding things fucks me up big time.
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lionsarebigkittens 4y ago
Thanks for this, it affected my perspective.