Mid 30s. 6’2 broad shoulders, semi handsome face. Moderate career success. White. American
If you’re trying to date up as a man, it’s always a losing strategy. Any temporary success will be lost if the girl finds out who you really are, which will happen eventually.
Your best bet is to find the hottest girl that you can below you. Obviously her body needs to turn you on, her face can’t be hard to look at, strong maternal/breeding instincts, raised by a real father, mind not rotted by hormonal BC, doesn’t embarrass you in front of your friends, etc, etc.
There were a few girls in my life who ended up worshipping me and we fucked regularly. Good girls. Girls next door. They even met my friends. But there was always this thought in my head that I could dispose to of them if necessary (true, but not without some elbow grease) or I could get better (true, but no hope of permanency)
So if I can bestow one lesson here, and without writing a wall of text no one will read, it would be, if you find yourself in a situation with a girl who meets all the requirements I stated in my third paragraph, keep her around. Save taking action on the “I can do better” for your career and other aspects of your life.
As an aside, I would say it’s possible to find an arbitrage opportunity to date up, IF…AND ONLY IF, you fulfill a requirement of hers because of life circumstance. As an example, one ex was a super hot half Latina who really just wanted to breed whiter children (I have strong Northman ancestry). Another example is a super hot girl I met in Italy, Lucia was her name. In America she would have NEVER even given me the time of day. But I was foreign, capable, passed a certain value threshold, and could have delivered her to the promise land
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Musicgoon78 1 4mo ago
I'm going to disagree. This is a bit on the side of pedestalization or a lack of true confidence. I was married, I am divorced. It was a mistake and made me realize that I wanted, needed and deserved better. My parents are on their last few years of life and I've had medical issues that could cause me to pass away at any time. When you're staring into the void you realize that nobody has as much time as they want.
"She's a few steps below me" sounds like you've capped your value in the dating market. It also sounds like settling.
I go after what I want. Fuck this bullshit about leagues or a numbering system. I don't give a shit. I shoot my shot. I get the girls I want. I get the sex I want and they live up to my standards or get booted off my ship.
After my divorce I had no idea what type of women I could pull. I was overweight, homeless, jobless. I had a motorcycle and a few changes of clothes. All I cared about was my freedom and now having potential again. Fuck it, I was going to go after what I wanted. Freedom was sweet. You know what happened? I got to taste all 31 flavors my guy. Rich women, models, basic bitches, every race, chunky chicks and fit women. Also....3somes! I did better than I ever dreamed of. It was simply because I knew what I wanted, didn't think of my shortcomings, and went after that.
Save taking action on the “I can do better” for your career and other aspects of your life.
This is a defeatist attitude. I suggest to anyone reading this that following this advice will lead to dissatisfaction in the long term.
Lone_Ranger 2 4mo ago
You could simply have posted "select for behaviours, not hawtness"
The guys that I know that really run into issues with women (divorce rape etc) all got there because they selected for hawtness. They married dumb, hot, sexy, entitled, retarded sluts, just because they were 'hawt'.
Most men make this mistake. They simply select the hawtest chick that their they can afford, and then act all but hurt when it pans out the way it was always going to work. Men learn this too late.
Lone_Ranger 2 4mo ago
"if you are trying to date up as a man".... what are you talking about? Do you mean on looks? This is pretty dumb.
I agree with nearly every thing you say though. My advice would be that you really have to select for character, and forget about all other considerations. And also, make sure you meet the family and know the family. Watch out for any signs of trauma. What are her relations with her parents like. Does she behave like an adult?
benzino 4mo ago
I dated a Korean girl who was very LTR material. Body count of 1. Catholic family. Tight relationship with her parents, brother and sister. Never been to a club, does not drink. Her only hobby is to go to cafes, cook and watch dramas. She was also crazy for me. She was about 6 or a generous 7 out of 10 in terms of looks.
The only downside is she's super boring. There's nothing to talk to with her. She had to return due to visa problems so we broke up. But out of all my relationships, she has been the most pleasant one. Zero drama
Lone_Ranger 2 4mo ago
Perhaps she would have made a good LTR? mother of your future kids?
HERE's the thing: women are boring. They just are. Lets be real.
You said there was nothing to talk about...that is what your homies are for
Musicgoon78 1 4mo ago
Why do they have to be boring? Find another one that stimulates you. C'mon bro... This is the settling for bullshit show today on TRP.
benzino 4mo ago
yup. realized that way too late. but it is what it is. it turned into a LDR at the end so breaking up was the right thing to do anyway.
We're still friends though, pretty sure she's the only ex I can still keep in touch with
On a side note, there are girls who can hold a conversation. I tend to go for the smart type and many can talk with me about philosophy, music, cinema etc... They are the ones with the most issues though lol
Lone_Ranger 2 4mo ago
I dont think they are the ones with the most issues.... they only seem like the ones with the most issues, because you actually talk to them - and then you become aware of their issues.
my experince of women is that they are all a seething cauldron of issues. they all are.
Women that are boring and don't have much to say.... its not a deal breaker. I would rather a woman that was boring but
loyal, hard working, good natured, friendly, loved sex, affectionate, liked cleaning and cooking, made me feel good, polite,
Vermillion-Rx Admin 4mo ago
Good shit in my opinion
SpiritualEnema 4mo ago
This is a good idea is general. A woman HAS to be able to look up to her man. That’s why orbiting is such a losing strategy.
Lone_Ranger 2 4mo ago
darn right... orbiting is super beta.
Problematic_Browser 1 4mo ago
Dating up isn't really an option for the American man.
Why? Because American women are useless dumpster sluts.
In my moderate experience, American women have been allowed to be the worst versions of women because men have set the bar at "give me vagina please" - something that doesn't happen in most of the world. Moreover, American men are - by global standards - the most achieving demographic of men in the world. Those two factors make it damn near impossible to find a woman above us in the areas that women care about.
Just remember: treat them like the trash they are, or they'll leave you for the man that does.
Lone_Ranger 2 4mo ago
"Just remember: treat them like the trash they are, or they'll leave you for the man that does."
HEY - thats my line!!!
love that you're quoting it but the super bro thing to do would be to @ me...
Problematic_Browser 1 4mo ago
Id give you credit if this wasn't something that is said ALL the time
Lone_Ranger 2 4mo ago
my exactly line is slightly different....
"Treat them like the dog shit that they are or they will find a man that will"
AbusiveFather1 4mo ago
I wish someone told me this when I was younger.
Same thing with all of the women in my life. We also have to keep in mind that it's not that pussy is undervalued everywhere else in the world, it's that pussy's value is overinflated in the USA. I'm not even talking about Latin America, Eastern Europe or Asia right now; even Western Europe is much better in these regards than the US.
which would've been a fatal mistake, because she would be poisoned and totally ruined by the american breed of feminism
Maturin_nj 4mo ago
This is Good advice. A viable high probability strategy. It's really a shame what a large segment of American men have permitted. Must have a great attitude as well.
Intrepid_Place53900 1 4mo ago
Yes, amazing what american men, have done to themselves. Onlyfans just disgusts/baffles me
Problematic_Browser 1 4mo ago
You know what's wild about that? If you criticize men for using it, WOMEN will get mad!
It's insane how women will fight for the right to be pimped.
Intrepid_Place53900 1 4mo ago
yup, they want to keep all their options open.
Overkill_Engine 2 4mo ago
Right up until those option are no longer open to them. Then, it's time to pull up that ladder behind themselves and shame shame shame away!
EurasianChad 1 4mo ago
The point is to be so on-point with your life that you don't have to pretend.
Girls who have high SMV obviously have more options. Your best bet is to be SO UNDENIABLY GREAT that you dominate any lane you throw yourself into. You have the power to control your life. You dictate how much effort you put into your craft/career/finance/social skills etc.
Thats what generates high self esteem dude. Do it for yourself.
Intrepid_Place53900 1 4mo ago
agree with much of what you say.
My girl is (adjusting for age of course), face 6, body 7 or 8, I'm probably an 8 in both. She tells me that I could get pretty much any girl I want.
Generally a girl just just below your SMV is best for LTR. I mean, we all know you can get girls above your SMV, if you have $$. They are with you because of the $$ though.
Myself, I want a girl who desires "me", not what I have. Now, I know what I have is always part of that variable. But an example is , I don't show that I have money, I don't spend money on them, I don't have fancy cars, I "act" like I don't have much. I don't even have a house, I rent an apartment, or did before I moved into my LTR girls house. She didn't know what I had, until after.
For me, I wanted her to earn it, I wanted her to want me , not what I have or the lifestyle I could give her,etc. I want her to desire to keep me happy.
The girl I have, gets it. She wants to keep my belly full and balls empty to put it simply and she's good at it.
I still don't share purchases with her, what's hers is hers, what is mine is mine. She knows I have a lot more than her and she also was told, she's not getting it. My boys are, unless I spend it all first.
For me, this works.
whytehorse2021 4mo ago
The real trick is knowing what is below you. If you go by modern female standards you're going to get screwed. They will tell you foreign women are lesser than them, poorer women are less than them, uneducated women are less, etc. Play your cards right and you might end up with an HB10 supermodel like Ivanka Trump even though you're a fraud and narcissist.
Maturin_nj 4mo ago
If you look at his story, it's a big part daddy issues. Greg Norman is another sociopath narcissist with serious daddy issues. ,One thing the mother fucker has is an ability to play the game at his age. All those court cases, getting slammed, etc....I'm 16 years younger and couldn't put up with all that shit. I'd snap. Even Joe putting on a suit every morning is mind boggling to me.
These guys are in their own sense ultra blue pilled in the wsy the system consumed them and their desire to prove themselves to it. It's all these fuckers know. Country clubs are full of them. Sartres philosophy is based on this in "Being and Nothingness". He calls people like this acting in 'bad faith' since they are the least free but the most inauthentic of human beings. I encountered legions of inauthentics like this who had completely lost any semblance of their identity to their label of 'lawyer'. Everything revolved around this identity. An entire world view. There are similarities to hard core religiousts like evangelicals true believes (not the phonies) and trad catholics. Corporations are full of them as well. People reduced to mere shells.